Doc Democracy

You going to play on the Cromwellian nature of that name?

So why does the hit location system focus on delivering more damage for hitting critical areas? I think there is good evidence in the system for better hits gaining better damage (though it may not have been intentional!!). I have nothing against folk not utilising the to hit roll to indicate better hits or more accurate hits but I am presuming that you would do hit locations differently too.. :-P

You need to consider why you rather use the UK to the US. With superheroes I much prefer to play where I understand the rules as superheroes change those rules in unexpected ways. There are some pretty fundamental differences to the ways the UK works to the US. It is therefore a useful way to highlight stuff. It is also an easy way to get caught out in game. If you want to use the UK, and I am presuming you are not British, bounce stuff off the UK members here. We can explain how things work. Doc

I love reading Neil's posts, he thinks about things in a way that I do not and, even if I do not always agree, it is useful. :-) To my view, the value in levels is the ability to switch from OCV to DCV depending on circumstances. levels may not compete with OCV in this respect for hitting or for doing added damage but they do mean I might get hit less and for less damage when facing someone with a much higher OCV. When you buy levels you are paying for flexibility...

I would be inclined to buy the most expensive attack and then add each additional one for 5pts. I might allow a limitation on the 5pts as the use of the weapons and the ability to switch between them is limited. Doc

You know, this is one of those things that sound like a feature of the magic rather than just a feature of the person. You do not say anything about the rationale (and for Vancian magic that is not always unusual!) for not benefitting from healing magic but if it is possible that all healing magic does not work for people with the same problem then you build that into the magic and the character would just take a physical limitation of healing has limited effect. That also means you can rate it - low level you subtract a few dice, moderate a few more, severe, even more... otherwise I might decide to build a negative power. Power defence, only versus healing magic. I would build it - suss how many points it would cost and give that cost as a complication...(all depending on what the cost was - wouldnt want to make it a thing that everyone would want to take for the points...) Doc

With three different builds and at least one impassioned plea for folk to accept a single true way...

Absolutely but I was thinking that the OP was looking for guidance on how to use the stuff rather than list of kit and equipment. If it is a set of shopping lists then there are multiple books or you can generate your own based on your campaign needs. Two views??

You know, I would not worry too much about that. If you want people to have stuff they can buy with money then there is no need for rules beyond how much money you give them and what access you give them to buy stuff. In modern day you can manage money in the normal way and get price lists (where costs go up as they want things not in the shops). The key rule that I use in heroic games is that anything that can be bought for money can be taken away from you in the narrative and for good narrative reasons and you have no reasonable expectation of getting it back. If, however, you buy a pistol with points then you can expect to find said pistol at convenient locations if you get it taken away from you. So, you have a pistol, paid for by points, and get captured. You lose the pistol. When you escape, that same pistol or one at least as good, is available for you to pick up and use. It is yours and the points should stretch the narrative to give you access to it. Doc

You are entirely correct, Scott hangs out sometimes too. Am now wondering what book I have been picturing as Villainy Amok with Dean's name on the front..

I think the big issue here is the use of complete. The name Champions Complete was pretty cool as it was CC and that the book was written to provide a GM with the ability to have all the information necessary to run a champions game. It was also intended to be a more stripped down version of the rules. It is. It does the job intended, it will never have as much detail as the most recent authoritative version of the HERO System. However, everyone will agree (I hope) that Champions Complete does not have every nuance of the rules necessary to be assured that there is no wrinkle unconsidered (this I think is an impossibility and no rulebook will ever manage to be absolutely complete - indeed Champions is notorious for not accommodating absolutes!). What CC does do is give a complete game available in electronic and dead tree formats that keep the game breathing. What Steve does is provide insight into the last version of the HERO System which, despite the significant number of people who dislike the format, still available in PDF. Doc

I recommend villainy amok by Dean Shomshak, who frequents these boards. A cool resource for planning games, plotting and shaking things up. Doc

Sounds like they are already gaining an advantage by having powers they get to apply more often than their ill-rolling brethren already. As I said, it is, or should be player-driven. Ask them. Simply ask, "if you roll well to hit, do you feel that should be reflected in a bit more damage?". You might be surprised by the answers, I thought it would be more mixed in my group but it was almost unanimous.

Not sure where you are coming from with this. It sounds like you have players that never hit or, when they do, it is by exactly what they need. Otherwise EVERYONE that hits by one or more than they need get access to this bonus... However, it is all about the players, for some groups, this will play into a need to see hit rolls have some effect on damage. For others it may not. To me, it is a neat little tool that I can add to my toolkit to design the game feel I might, at some point, be looking for. Doc

kappa phi kappa :-) The midwives (delivering a better future for women)

It does. But only in the reflection of the damage. 2D6 killing attack will never do more than 12 BODY and 60 STUN. If the staff does not take the damage then the reverberations might simply be transmitted to the hand holding it...

Neil, have a read of the haymaker with a bow thread. I am thinking that you add as many dice as you want but the damage dished out cannot exceed the maximum of the original weapon/attack. excess damage is applied to the weapon as it overwhelms its structural capacity I think that feels more apt than arbitrary limits etc. Doc

Yeah, set effect is right. It gives you a little comfort zone. Any roll from 29 to 35 will deliver you 35 STUN, anything below 29 gets a 6 STUN boost while everything above 35 STUN gets nothing. :-)

In your opinion Tholomyes, in your opinion. You have to remember that we are all spouting opinion here and I think the opposition you have received to your contributions is not because of the (very helpful) mathematical analysis - that is one of the reasons I bring things to the board - others are far more focussed on that than I am. However, you translate things into very black and white terms and impose your value judgement on it. I dont actually need your opinion of whether adding damage for rolling well is highly flawed or not and the value I put on the reasons you find it flawed can be coloured by the fact you lead off with that opinion. This is an example of the black and white. Rather than look for the compromise. Ninja Bear is proposing something that a lot of people think about. Personally I think it is a workable idea but only worth limitation if, for example, the added damage only kicks in if the roll (of 10D6) is below 35 and will only supplement upto the value of 35. That has a significant impact on the average damage of the roll but is significantly less impactful than just adding 2D6 to the attack. Looking for the compromise or providing insight rather than looking for numerical reasons to trash the idea often gains more traction. All of this, of course, in my own highly individual opinion... :-) Doc

I am not good at maths, however, 6D6 on average roll 21 STUN. that is (1+2+3+4+5+6)/6 * 6 Now if we presume 1s and 2s are re-rolled that becomes (3.5+3.5+3+4+5+6)/6 * 6 = 25 STUN As most low numbers get bumped up it skews the bell-curve, pushing more results towards the centre. So you can expect fewe low rolls and on average about a 20% bump in STUN damage...

check out the UK TV series Misfits, much lower power level but a great view on normal folk suddenly granted random powers... http://www.channel4.com/programmes/misfits

Hello critical hit optional rules, meet a graduated cousin...

This may be purely my group but they do seem to like being rewarded for good rolls. I like rewarding my players in game, it makes it a more rewarding experience for all of us. :-) As such this cannot be about choosing a manoeuvre. This process is one way where I can provide an easy bennie to my players when they feel like they have done well. I guess another way round that is to throw them a Hero Point every time they roll really well - something they can use now or can store up for use another time. Like in FATE, I think that if they get a steady flow of HERO points that they would use them more frivolously too...

Not sure I said it here but I am looking at providing a corollory glancing blow element for the heavy hitters. Possibly remove a six from the damage pool to gain an extra +1 OCV. Or something like that. I am tired of superhero combats where it is all just a little bit too predictable and where I have balanced it so well that things take a little bit longer to resolve. I could push different builds in different ways but I want there to be different ways to achieve stuff and I want to push people into more extreme versions of the archetypes. It is probably my fault but too many of my friends characters end up with a broad range of everything and there is nothing in the system that then adds in the variability I like to see. So, something for the high OCV folk to maximise their damage and something for the heavy hitters to deliver glancing blows. There is indeed nothing in the system that says the to-hit roll is involved in how well someone hits (or how well someone delivers damage) but I am interested in trying it. And even if it works for me and my group - there is no reason that it will necessarily work for anyone elses... :-) However, I think I almost enjoy talking about what I want to do more than I enjoy doing it.... :-( Doc

There is a reasonable point here. When we as GMs put limits on things, like how many dice you can roll, what are we actually saying? 1 - I am content that you will do sufficient damage to be viable in my world 2 - I am content that you will not do so much damage that I will need to unduly raise defence values on my villains. We know, as GMs, that a 10D6 attack will usually do around 35 STUN 10 BODY and that will usually vary between about 29 - 42 STUN depending on how well the damage roll goes. It is POSSIBLE that an attack will do as little as 10 STUN or as much as 60. Everyone around the table would be stunned if that happened though (even for our worst dice rollers!). If you purchase additional dice simply to boost damage then you are moving away from that cozy arrangement. Suddenly I have to accept that your character will be doing, on average, 41 STUN and probably varying between 35 and 47. That is a significant shift, as significant as allowing the character 12D6. Capping damage at 60 STUN does not actually limit the attack so much as everyone would still be amazed if you rolled 54 STUN on those 10 dice. However, if you capped the damage about 42, then you would be beating the bell curve - as the results would pile up around that number and abnormally high rolls would be ignored. As such, there is limitation in capping damage but you need to be careful about what and where you cap if you want it to have actual impact in the game. Both your proposal and mine, increase the damage available in the game and mine actually makes the damage more variable (so you cannot game the balance as easily). Doc