Dr. MID-Nite Posted November 4, 2020 Report Share Posted November 4, 2020 52 minutes ago, Greywind said: So the urban parts of the country are the only parts that matter? With all due respect, I came nowhere near to saying that. I was stating that that rural and suburban communities(of which I happen to be part) tend to see the problems and issues in America as something that happens to other people...often with the caveats such as "well they shouldn't live in such a slum" or "well if they only worked harder..they'd be fine" and other such general statements that ignore American realities. Issues are something that happen to other people and everything would be fine if they "just stopped causing trouble". They don't see it...so it doesn't exist. At the same time....because they're isolated both in reality and thought from America's urban areas...they also believe in issues they're told exist because they have no context to believe otherwise. Again....out of touch. And you might try asking for clarification before quoting me out of context next time. Thanks. 22 minutes ago, Greywind said: There's more rural areas than there are urban areas. So maybe it is the urban areas that are out of touch with the realities of the rest of the country. And more people live in urban areas than live in rural areas. If you're going to use that logic, I'll simply say people matter more than land. Again, I live in a semi rural area....and I've lived in urban and suburban areas in the past. I have firsthand experience. Ragitsu, TrickstaPriest, Matt the Bruins and 1 other 2 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archer Posted November 4, 2020 Report Share Posted November 4, 2020 NBC projects Biden as winner in Michigan. That's in addition to Wisconsin earlier in the day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greywind Posted November 4, 2020 Report Share Posted November 4, 2020 https://www.judicialwatch.org/in-the-news/1-8-mill-ghost-voters Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greywind Posted November 4, 2020 Report Share Posted November 4, 2020 26 minutes ago, Hermit said: Argue that with Dr. Mid-Nite, I was just pointing out he hadn't said what you said he did. Debate is hard enough without folks putting words in others mouths. Me? I think Archer is closer to the mark (no archery pun intended). It does seem sometimes the Rural/Urban divide do not get each other at all. I know city dwellers who think Brown Cows are where you get chocolate milk from, and know some in rural areas that believe the entire city of Portland Ore was on fire during the protests there. We've got a real communication problem in our country. And some city dwellers think meat comes from grocery stores where no animals are harmed. Starlord 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hermit Posted November 4, 2020 Report Share Posted November 4, 2020 4 minutes ago, Greywind said: And some city dwellers think meat comes from grocery stores where no animals are harmed. True Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Starlord Posted November 4, 2020 Report Share Posted November 4, 2020 So I guess we're waiting to see if this is the end of Avengers Infinity War or Avengers Endgame - Jimmy Kimmel wcw43921 and Hermit 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lectryk Posted November 4, 2020 Report Share Posted November 4, 2020 51 minutes ago, Greywind said: https://www.judicialwatch.org/in-the-news/1-8-mill-ghost-voters Warnings from this site should come with a social media veracity warning - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Judicial_Watch Activities and controversies[edit] Judicial Watch’s main targets have been Democrats, particularly Bill and Hillary Clinton and the Obama administration.[17] Matt the Bruins, Old Man, Cygnia and 1 other 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archer Posted November 4, 2020 Report Share Posted November 4, 2020 1 hour ago, Greywind said: https://www.judicialwatch.org/in-the-news/1-8-mill-ghost-voters Unfortunately, outdated voter registration rolls are just a part of elections these days. Republicans want to take an axe to voter rolls in order to remove legit voters who don't vote every election in addition to removing people who should be removed (such as people who have died or moved from that address). Democrats, on the other hand, resist any efforts to update registration rolls to remove people who really shouldn't be there because they know Republicans are looking for excuses to remove real voters. But as the article points out, that isn't evidence that anyone at all voted illegally. It just means that there would have been more opportunities for people to have attempted to cast illegal votes than would have existed otherwise. (And the difference in the number of opportunities is trivial.) That is not, at all, like that one precinct in Philadelphia in the 2004 election which had more people cast votes there than were registered (which implied that no registered voter got sick, died, was called out of town, or forgot to vote plus a lot of unregistered citizens did same day registration...else something really unusual happened in that one relatively small place). I don't remember offhand exactly what the voting rate in similar precincts in the same city was but I think it was less than 50%. So someone could point to that place and legitimately say "I think something happened there because the voting rate was higher than 100% and was wildly different than other precincts in the same area". But pointing to registration rolls which haven't been updated and trying to claim, "There was definitely fraud going on"...would be a silly claim if someone were to make it (counting down from three to when the president tweets out about it 3...2...1....) TrickstaPriest 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archer Posted November 4, 2020 Report Share Posted November 4, 2020 Centerists House Democrats are talking about ousting Pelosi from the Speakership. They blame her for not going after Trump earlier on impeachment charges and for not attacking him more strenuously during the election. (She did seem to drop out of sight a lot more than I would have expected. And it's not unusual for the membership to blame the leader for losses or for smaller than expected gains.) And they think that a fresh face might be better able to negotiate with Republicans in the House and Senate to shepherd through President Biden's legislation. https://thehill.com/homenews/house/524503-centrist-democrats-talk-leadership-changes-after-negative-election-results TrickstaPriest 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
megaplayboy Posted November 4, 2020 Report Share Posted November 4, 2020 6 minutes ago, archer said: Centerists House Democrats are talking about ousting Pelosi from the Speakership. They blame her for not going after Trump earlier on impeachment charges and for not attacking him more strenuously during the election. (She did seem to drop out of sight a lot more than I would have expected. And it's not unusual for the membership to blame the leader for losses or for smaller than expected gains.) And they think that a fresh face might be better able to negotiate with Republicans in the House and Senate to shepherd through President Biden's legislation. https://thehill.com/homenews/house/524503-centrist-democrats-talk-leadership-changes-after-negative-election-results It seems like an unnecessary fight. She already agreed that this next term would be her last in Congress and as Speaker. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greywind Posted November 4, 2020 Report Share Posted November 4, 2020 Wisconsin is looking at a recount. Apparently they have more votes than voters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archer Posted November 4, 2020 Report Share Posted November 4, 2020 8 minutes ago, Greywind said: Wisconsin is looking at a recount. Apparently they have more votes than voters. You will need to explain that statement with more precision in order for me to understand it. They have fewer votes than they have registered voters...so I'm not sure what you're trying to communicate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L. Marcus Posted November 5, 2020 Report Share Posted November 5, 2020 According to Snopes, someone compared votes cast in this election to the registered voters of 2018. Of course, this went viral. Tom Cowan, TrickstaPriest and Old Man 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Man Posted November 5, 2020 Report Share Posted November 5, 2020 It's not as though people were more motivated than usual to vote this election. Would it be possible to start backing up some of these assertions with reputable sources? I'm as guilty of this as anyone but in the current climate of misinformation we really need to check our sources before posting here. Hugh Neilson and TrickstaPriest 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. MID-Nite Posted November 5, 2020 Report Share Posted November 5, 2020 50 minutes ago, L. Marcus said: According to Snopes, someone compared votes cast in this election to the registered voters of 2018. Of course, this went viral. Because you couldn't register to vote in 2019 or 2020? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unclevlad Posted November 5, 2020 Report Share Posted November 5, 2020 4 hours ago, Greywind said: https://www.judicialwatch.org/in-the-news/1-8-mill-ghost-voters And they're just bouncing a story from the Washington Times, which might as well be Fox News. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archer Posted November 5, 2020 Report Share Posted November 5, 2020 MSNBC has reported that the Trump campaign has filed lawsuits to stop counting the vote in Georgia, Pennsylvania, and Michigan. Humorously, Trump is behind in the vote currently in Michigan so if his lawsuit is successful, he will have succeeded in giving the state to Biden. Hey @Hermit, remember when I told you last week that my worry was that they wouldn't count the vote at all? Michigan and Pennsylvania: https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/524533-trump-campaign-mounts-legal-effort-as-race-favors-biden Georgia: https://thehill.com/regulation/court-battles/524571-new-trump-campaign-lawsuit-targets-late-arriving-georgia-mail Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sociotard Posted November 5, 2020 Report Share Posted November 5, 2020 I often hear the argument that the electoral college ensures politicians care about small states. If that is its goal, I maintain it does not do it well. The implication is that if it were not for the electoral college, politicians would only care about New York and California. But, with the college, they care about Florida and Pennsylvania instead. This is not a great improvement. I live in Idaho. The only reason politicians can distinguish us from Iowa is because at least that state has an important primary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ragitsu Posted November 5, 2020 Report Share Posted November 5, 2020 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Liaden Posted November 5, 2020 Report Share Posted November 5, 2020 I found this pretty insightful, as an explanation for committed Trumpists. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pariah Posted November 5, 2020 Report Share Posted November 5, 2020 1 hour ago, archer said: MSNBC has reported that the Trump campaign has filed lawsuits to stop counting the vote in Georgia, Pennsylvania, and Michigan. Humorously, Trump is behind in the vote currently in Michigan so if his lawsuit is successful, he will have succeeded in giving the state to Biden. Hey @Hermit, remember when I told you last week that my worry was that they wouldn't count the vote at all? Michigan and Pennsylvania: https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/524533-trump-campaign-mounts-legal-effort-as-race-favors-biden Georgia: https://thehill.com/regulation/court-battles/524571-new-trump-campaign-lawsuit-targets-late-arriving-georgia-mail Republican allies break with Trump, say take time to count all the votes The fact that Senators Mitch McConnell and Mike Lee are calling the President out on this is a bit surprising. But it gives me some hope, is it demonstrates that they at least know the correct process exists. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sociotard Posted November 5, 2020 Report Share Posted November 5, 2020 In interesting article that explains how the mysterious 130000 Biden votes might not be all that fishy. https://www.vox.com/recode/2020/11/4/21549710/biden-michigan-votes-trump-retweet-election-map Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Liaden Posted November 5, 2020 Report Share Posted November 5, 2020 17 minutes ago, Pariah said: Republican allies break with Trump, say take time to count all the votes The fact that Senators Mitch McConnell and Mike Lee are calling the President out on this is a bit surprising. But it gives me some hope, is it demonstrates that they at least know the correct process exists. IMO they must have some tactical reason in mind. Republicans have been subtly distancing themselves from Trump for several weeks, probably out of concern that aligning so closely with him as in the past could hurt their own political chances. Ragitsu 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archer Posted November 5, 2020 Report Share Posted November 5, 2020 27 minutes ago, Sociotard said: In interesting article that explains how the mysterious 130000 Biden votes might not be all that fishy. https://www.vox.com/recode/2020/11/4/21549710/biden-michigan-votes-trump-retweet-election-map When that typo came through to MSNBC, Steve Kornacki refused to put it on the screen so viewers could see it or discuss it when Rachel Maddow asked about it. He said that he thought the numbers had to be a mistake and on the air asked his producers to double check in order to find out whether the information was real. That network, at least, never aired the incorrect number. That was pretty classy in my opinion considering that the hosts were doing everything but openly cheerleading for Biden. Of course, it did leave me wondering just exactly what the incorrect information was until I saw it from other sources.... 27 minutes ago, Sociotard said: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hermit Posted November 5, 2020 Report Share Posted November 5, 2020 2 hours ago, archer said: MSNBC has reported that the Trump campaign has filed lawsuits to stop counting the vote in Georgia, Pennsylvania, and Michigan. Humorously, Trump is behind in the vote currently in Michigan so if his lawsuit is successful, he will have succeeded in giving the state to Biden. Hey @Hermit, remember when I told you last week that my worry was that they wouldn't count the vote at all? Michigan and Pennsylvania: https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/524533-trump-campaign-mounts-legal-effort-as-race-favors-biden Georgia: https://thehill.com/regulation/court-battles/524571-new-trump-campaign-lawsuit-targets-late-arriving-georgia-mail Yup. I do recall. Wish I could say I am surprised you were right to be concerned about that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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