Lord Liaden Posted November 18, 2017 Report Share Posted November 18, 2017 Well, first off, too much emphasis is placed on domestic opening weekend. Wonder Woman did much better long-term than her opening weekend total would suggest, because there was so little drop-off from week to week. Also, foreign b.o. is a lot more important now than it used to be, and JL has already made $37 million in China alone, without the weekend even being over. And that's another thing -- we haven't yet gotten the official tally for Saturday, let alone Sunday. Advance estimates are often different from the real numbers. Besides, JL is currently dealing with a recent major competitor in the superhero movie genre, Thor Ragnarok. It's much too soon to either push the panic button or do a victory dance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrinku Posted November 19, 2017 Report Share Posted November 19, 2017 One does question why it cost $300 million to make, however. Thor: Ragnarok only cost $180 million and I really doubt there's much to choose between them as far as post-production work is concerned. (Haven't seen JL yet, but some of those sequences in Thor were absolutely jaw-dropping.) Neither of those figures include the promotional budgets either. Justice League has to do pretty well to have been worth making at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zslane Posted November 19, 2017 Report Share Posted November 19, 2017 The most expensive part of any tentpole movie today is actor salaries. I suspect that JL's cast cost quite a bit more overall. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ternaugh Posted November 19, 2017 Report Share Posted November 19, 2017 I think that there's something screwy with the budget numbers. Avengers: Age of Ultron and Captain America: Civil War both had budgets in the $250 million range. My guess is that there's a lot more fiscal oversight of Marvel productions at the House of Mouse than DC movies have at Warner Brothers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazza Posted November 19, 2017 Report Share Posted November 19, 2017 57 minutes ago, mrinku said: One does question why it cost $300 million to make, however. Thor: Ragnarok only cost $180 million and I really doubt there's much to choose between them as far as post-production work is concerned. (Haven't seen JL yet, but some of those sequences in Thor were absolutely jaw-dropping.) Neither of those figures include the promotional budgets either. Justice League has to do pretty well to have been worth making at all. Joss's reshoot account for 15-20% of the finished film. https://screenrant.com/justice-league-joss-whedon-reshoots-amount/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrinku Posted November 19, 2017 Report Share Posted November 19, 2017 There were significant reshoots for Thor as well. Relocating the Odin death scene and arrival of Hela from New York to Iceland, for a start. To be honest, I'd be surprised if the salaries were much different, unless percentage deals were cut. Star-wise they're at least evenly matched. If anything, the Marvel crew's agents should have been able to cut much better deals due to the success of their movies vs the DC crowd's ones. Thor added Cate Blanchett to Hemsworth, Hiddleston, Goldblum and Ruffalo (and I'm sure Sir Anthony Hopkins didn't turn up again for free...), while Justice League has Affleck, Cavell, Gadot, Mamoa and Ciarán Hinds. I've left out the cast members with less acting profile. It does look like principal photography for Thor may have been shorter than that for Justice League; the length of the shoot (and thus the wages for everyone involved) is a major expense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tech priest support Posted November 19, 2017 Report Share Posted November 19, 2017 Hollywood keeps its books in a way no one else does or would be allowed to do. Hell, according to Hollywood return of the Jedi has never made a profit. No, not a joke. Lucasfilms said that with a straight face. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hollywood_accounting Grossly inflated production costs help avoid having to show taxable profits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zslane Posted November 19, 2017 Report Share Posted November 19, 2017 Um, Jeremy Irons, Diane Lane, J.K. Simmons, and Joe Morton don't work for free, and two of them are Oscar winners and one is a multiple Oscar and Golden Globe nominee. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sinanju Posted November 19, 2017 Report Share Posted November 19, 2017 12 hours ago, Tech priest support said: Hollywood keeps its books in a way no one else does or would be allowed to do. Hell, according to Hollywood return of the Jedi has never made a profit. No, not a joke. Lucasfilms said that with a straight face. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hollywood_accounting Grossly inflated production costs help avoid having to show taxable profits. "The net is fiction." Never, ever agree to a cut of the net profits from Hollywood. Always demand a cut of the gross. "We lost $400,000,000 on that movie!" "I don't care. You brought in $1.5 billion in gross receipts. Gimme me cut." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrinku Posted November 20, 2017 Report Share Posted November 20, 2017 6 hours ago, zslane said: Um, Jeremy Irons, Diane Lane, J.K. Simmons, and Joe Morton don't work for free, and two of them are Oscar winners and one is a multiple Oscar and Golden Globe nominee. Perhaps I should have included Benedict Cumberbatch (Oscar and Golden Globe Nominee, multiple BAFTA winner), Karl Urban, Tessa Thompson, Idris Elba (Golden Globe, SAG and BAFTA winner) and Taika Waititi (Oscar nominee) for Thor, then? And Matt Damon is there too if you're adding up awards. If you include the main casts, Cate Blanchett and Anthony Hopkins are also multiple Oscar winners; Justice League's main cast only has Ben Affleck. Look, I'm not saying the cost blowout wasn't fuelled by actor salaries. Just that if it was the main reason for League costing 120 million more that Thor, they really suck at negotiation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christopher R Taylor Posted November 20, 2017 Report Share Posted November 20, 2017 My guess is that the extremely heavy use of CGI drove up the price, and frankly, DC was willing to throw the bank at this, so it got spent. A lot of the money that goes into making movies doesn't actually have much to do with the movie, like catering, parties, lodging, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ternaugh Posted November 20, 2017 Report Share Posted November 20, 2017 1 hour ago, Christopher R Taylor said: My guess is that the extremely heavy use of CGI drove up the price, and frankly, DC was willing to throw the bank at this, so it got spent. A lot of the money that goes into making movies doesn't actually have much to do with the movie, like catering, parties, lodging, etc. Steven Mnuchin wasn't listed as a producer on JL*, so we can't blame him for expensive flights. *I believe that Wonder Woman was his last production credit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrinku Posted November 20, 2017 Report Share Posted November 20, 2017 Well, I have to stop short in comparing the CGI used in both, since I haven't seen JL yet. But Thor did use a lot. Maybe Thor being filmed in Australia and JL being filmed in England made more difference than you'd think? Ironically, the earlier attempt to get a JL movie up and running (the Megan Gale one) would have been filmed in Oz. Not that I begrudge Gal Gadot ending up with the role. Not. At. All. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zslane Posted November 20, 2017 Report Share Posted November 20, 2017 Disney is also famous for stiffing vfx houses for the work they do. WB probably paid up on all their post-production work, lacking the legal and financial muscle to do what Disney gets away with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazza Posted November 20, 2017 Report Share Posted November 20, 2017 Disney owns Industrial Light & Magic & Skywalker Sound. I reckon they could get a discount. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Starlord Posted November 20, 2017 Report Share Posted November 20, 2017 On 11/19/2017 at 2:52 AM, Bazza said: Joss's reshoot account for 15-20% of the finished film. https://screenrant.com/justice-league-joss-whedon-reshoots-amount/ Bazza already gave one reason and having watched both movies JL definitely used more CGI. Additionally, you could figure that JL essentially had at least four hours of footage to cut to two. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greywind Posted November 20, 2017 Author Report Share Posted November 20, 2017 On 11/19/2017 at 3:47 AM, mrinku said: There were significant reshoots for Thor as well. Relocating the Odin death scene and arrival of Hela from New York to Iceland, for a start. To be honest, I'd be surprised if the salaries were much different, unless percentage deals were cut. Star-wise they're at least evenly matched. If anything, the Marvel crew's agents should have been able to cut much better deals due to the success of their movies vs the DC crowd's ones. Thor added Cate Blanchett to Hemsworth, Hiddleston, Goldblum and Ruffalo (and I'm sure Sir Anthony Hopkins didn't turn up again for free...), while Justice League has Affleck, Cavell, Gadot, Mamoa and Ciarán Hinds. I've left out the cast members with less acting profile. It does look like principal photography for Thor may have been shorter than that for Justice League; the length of the shoot (and thus the wages for everyone involved) is a major expense. Ezra Miller isn't the unknown you seem to think he is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pattern Ghost Posted November 20, 2017 Report Share Posted November 20, 2017 8 minutes ago, Greywind said: Ezra Miller isn't the unknown you seem to think he is. Yeah, he's not just some wallflower. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hopcroft Posted November 20, 2017 Report Share Posted November 20, 2017 Haven't seen it yet, but Justice League looks every bit as bad as Wonder Woman is good. And Wonder Woman is very good.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hermit Posted November 20, 2017 Report Share Posted November 20, 2017 So far, the majority of posters on the board who have seen Justice League have mentioned liking it, some a great deal. I think there are like 5 of us, which is not a good sign for its success. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grailknight Posted November 20, 2017 Report Share Posted November 20, 2017 Just saw it yesterday. I went in braced for it to suck and was very pleasantly surprised. There's only one moment that I thought the heroes were stupid but they were justifiably distracted when they lost the box. The personalities of our heroes were very well done. The action was some of the best in any superhero movie. The fights were just the right length and well choreographed not dragging on forever like MoS or BvS. If they learn from this movie, then they may just have a bright future ahead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazza Posted November 20, 2017 Report Share Posted November 20, 2017 7 hours ago, Pattern Ghost said: Yeah, he's not just some wallflower. Who went to the Stanford prison experiment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrinku Posted November 20, 2017 Report Share Posted November 20, 2017 11 hours ago, Greywind said: Ezra Miller isn't the unknown you seem to think he is. Fair enough. He should have been included in that list, especially given he's playing a major role. My apologies. And I did include Tessa Thompson on the Thor side, who's roughly equivalent in terms of profile and body of work. Neither have won any major awards yet. Disney having in-house SFX may very well be enough to explain a lot of the budget, though, especially if they were sloppy with producing stuff that didn't get used. Waititi does appear to have run a pretty tight ship in that respect. And whatever deals they struck with the Australian (well... Queensland) and New Zealand governments probably helped (they were prominent in the end credits). As per LoTR, they grabbed the NZ army as extras for the big fight scenes, I believe. Hmm. This has really stopped being a thread about Wonder Woman. Start a new one? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zeropoint Posted November 21, 2017 Report Share Posted November 21, 2017 This thread seems like an appropriate place to share this pic: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greywind Posted November 21, 2017 Author Report Share Posted November 21, 2017 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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