Vondy Posted April 8, 2016 Report Share Posted April 8, 2016 Muscle tone doesn't matter to superhero combat performance. But it matters to superhero aesthetics, at least judging from the way artists draw them. And, those aesthetics play into assumptions / prejudices / expectations readers have that inform how they receive, interpret, and relate to the character. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zslane Posted April 8, 2016 Report Share Posted April 8, 2016 Agreed. But when it comes to Wonder Woman, I'm not sure there is a unified standard for how the general public will receive, interpret, and relate to any given design for the character. Did someone take a survey I'm not aware of? Or are we only going by how a majority of today's DC comic book readers would vote on the matter? In any case, the uncomfortable realities of casting in Hollywood preclude taking such a "standard" as gospel and forcing a 9-figure film production to meet that standard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vondy Posted April 8, 2016 Report Share Posted April 8, 2016 Agreed. But when it comes to Wonder Woman, I'm not sure there is a unified standard for how the general public will receive, interpret, and relate to any given design for the character. Did someone take a survey I'm not aware of? Or are we only going by how a majority of today's DC comic book readers would vote on the matter? In any case, the uncomfortable realities of casting in Hollywood preclude taking such a "standard" as gospel and forcing a 9-figure film production to meet that standard. From reading WW (we have books on the character's history in my house), I see three essential evolutions: Original slender Wondy (1941-1974) Bustier Linda Carter Wondy (1974 - 2005) And the Adam Hugh's very athletic Wondy (2005- ) She's basically become progressively bustier and then more muscular as time has marched on. People tend to remember what they have read personally to the exclusion of everything else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigdamnhero Posted April 9, 2016 Report Share Posted April 9, 2016 Does muscle tone matter for someone who can lift hundreds of tons? "I don't go to the gym. I'm just naturally like this." - Captain Hammer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ragitsu Posted April 9, 2016 Report Share Posted April 9, 2016 Does muscle tone matter for someone who can lift hundreds of tons? The issue with this stance in regards to this particular character is that on her own island Diana was "de-powered" and highly competitive, so she should have built up considerably more muscle mass in comparison to the rest of the women she sparred with. No different from regular humans training together in militaristic camps to become stronger warriors, as a matter of fact. Plus, Superman doesn't get a pass and he is certainly superpowered. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pattern Ghost Posted April 9, 2016 Report Share Posted April 9, 2016 Superman doesn't have brain energy from Aphrodite. He has to bulk up to create more surface area to soak in sunlight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ragitsu Posted April 9, 2016 Report Share Posted April 9, 2016 Superman doesn't have brain energy from Aphrodite. He has to bulk up to create more surface area to soak in sunlight. Superman sunbathes in the nude? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pattern Ghost Posted April 9, 2016 Report Share Posted April 9, 2016 UV penetrates cloth. But he also sunbathes in the nude. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vondy Posted April 9, 2016 Report Share Posted April 9, 2016 Superman sunbathes in the nude? He aint called Big Blue for nothing.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ragitsu Posted April 9, 2016 Report Share Posted April 9, 2016 UV penetrates cloth. But he also sunbathes in the nude. I had to ask, given that the iconic costume has been depicted as simple cloth that Ma Kent spun into his outfit...to Kryptonian super-spandex...to an article of clothing made of Ruleofcoolium that does whatever the plot demands...to... Plus, he knows that other individuals with X-Ray vision exist in his universe, so he might have sewn in some lead into his duds at some point (if for no other reason than to avoid awkwardness at any Super-family powwows). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pattern Ghost Posted April 9, 2016 Report Share Posted April 9, 2016 He aint called Big Blue for nothing.... You may be thinking of Doctor Manhattan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Outsider Posted April 9, 2016 Report Share Posted April 9, 2016 Superman doesn't have brain energy from Aphrodite. He has to bulk up to create more surface area to soak in sunlight. An immensely fat superman would have even more surface area to soak up that sunlight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zslane Posted April 10, 2016 Report Share Posted April 10, 2016 People tend to remember what they have read personally to the exclusion of everything else. That makes sense. Except that general audiences have never read a WW comic, and have probably never read more than one or two superhero comics period. As much as the studios give lip service to caring about what the hardcore comics fans will think, it is the hundreds of millions of non-comic readers that matter more to their bottom line. For older folks who were around in the 70s, the Lynda Carter version of WW is the closest thing there is to a recognizable "standard". But action heroes today, even female ones, would not be accepted by audiences today if they were built like Lynda Carter. Times have changed, and in terms of how you cast a female action star for a blockbuster movie, how things have changed in comic books matters little, even when comics are the source material. I'm pretty sure that WB decided that for a character that gets her strength from magical/semi-divine sources, her physical build is unimportant to conveying her power. With that out of the way, they were free to cast according to who was [a] available, affordable, [c] directable, and [d] smoking hot. I'm sure that getting in shape was a contingency for landing the role, and Gal Gadot certainly got into shape. The anime waif with god-like strength and power is so recognizable to today's nerds that I don't think anyone under the age of 25 questions Gadot's look one bit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vondy Posted April 10, 2016 Report Share Posted April 10, 2016 That makes sense. Except that general audiences have never read a WW comic, and have probably never read more than one or two superhero comics period. As much as the studios give lip service to caring about what the hardcore comics fans will think, it is the hundreds of millions of non-comic readers that matter more to their bottom line. For older folks who were around in the 70s, the Lynda Carter version of WW is the closest thing there is to a recognizable "standard". But action heroes today, even female ones, would not be accepted by audiences today if they were built like Lynda Carter. Times have changed, and in terms of how you cast a female action star for a blockbuster movie, how things have changed in comic books matters little, even when comics are the source material. I'm pretty sure that WB decided that for a character that gets her strength from magical/semi-divine sources, her physical build is unimportant to conveying her power. With that out of the way, they were free to cast according to who was [a] available, affordable, [c] directable, and [d] smoking hot. I'm sure that getting in shape was a contingency for landing the role, and Gal Gadot certainly got into shape. The anime waif with god-like strength and power is so recognizable to today's nerds that I don't think anyone under the age of 25 questions Gadot's look one bit. Agreed. The only thing general audiences (rather than comic fans) are going to care about is that Gal Gadot is hot, fit, and fairly statuesque. In other words, "wonderful." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enforcer84 Posted April 10, 2016 Report Share Posted April 10, 2016 I'd probably not try and lump comic-book fans into one category or even a few (ie Hard-Core) on these discussions. As most of the comic book fans on this site can't come to an accord on any movie, look, book, art direction, editorial direction, or voice actor for animation, in any genre we like and many we don't even give two tiny figs about. easier to say, 'you can't please some people' and leave it at that. I'm growing old and having been in the same arguments for a couple generations now I'm realizing how much the arguments themselves are the goal rather than the means to the goal. ...or I'm rationalizing my feelings of superiority. I can never remember which one it is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vondy Posted April 10, 2016 Report Share Posted April 10, 2016 I'd probably not try and lump comic-book fans into... I'm not really qualified to comment since I have zero plans to watch BvS or the JLA movies. In fact, I don't even have plans to watch all of the MCU movies. I'm not that big a fan. That said, I like the Adam Hughes Wondy, but I aint married to her... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazza Posted April 11, 2016 Report Share Posted April 11, 2016 In fact, I don't even have plans to watch all of the MCU movies. It's okay, I plan to watch them for you. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zslane Posted April 11, 2016 Report Share Posted April 11, 2016 ...I'm realizing how much the arguments themselves are the goal... Yeah, it's like the old saying: when two guys fight over a girl, it is usually the fight they want, not the girl. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slikmar Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 I was thinking an interesting way to do this movie would be to start off with Diana and Bruce talking about finding the heroes and him asking her about the picture and what she meant by leaving. She could then tell the story of her meeting Steve and fighting in WWI. They could take slow moments to "interrupt" as they meet with these other heroes and Bruce's plane gets more and more full as the movie goes on, thus doing her movie, tieing in with the universe AND setting up a Justice League movie where you don't have to introduce and find all the other heroes wasting the first hour or so of the movie, but instead use 5 minute vignettes in Wonder Woman. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pattern Ghost Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 Nah. I'd rather just have a Wonder Woman movie. They can gather the rest of the JL in its own movie. All they need is to have a huge thread threat and have everyone show up to deal with it, as in the original story. No need to give their origin stories at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greywind Posted April 13, 2016 Author Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 With a huge thread they can have a superhero sewing bee. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pattern Ghost Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 LOL. When I went to correct it, I typed "thread" again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Starlord Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 Its understandable...there are some threads on here that are quite threatening. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pattern Ghost Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 Now you're just stringing me along. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L. Marcus Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 A victim of woolly thinking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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