High Range Radio Perception with visual display?

[Skullkrak]

How would you go about adding a display to your HRRP? For example you have a wristband that creates a holographic display of a television program that those around you can also view.

[bigbywolfe]

Re: High Range Radio Perception with visual display?

 

Images, sight and sound, only to display HRRP signals.

[Enforcer84]

Re: High Range Radio Perception with visual display?

 

HRRP allows for audio and visual I believe.

for heads up displays I usually use the "Affected as more than once sense, sight and hearing as well as radio"

so someone blinded can't use the visual cues or deafened can't hear the radio portion even though the device still functions.

[bigbywolfe]

Re: High Range Radio Perception with visual display?

 

I think the key point was that others could also view/hear it.

[CptPatriot]

Re: High Range Radio Perception with visual display?

 

If HRRP is only to be used by the owner as in the case of a heads up display, then "Affected as more than one sense, sight and hearing as well as radio" is appropriate. Senses are not normally shared by others, to share the sensory data with others, the use of Images would be the best bet.

[Beast]

Re: High Range Radio Perception with visual display?

 

I used Images for an N-ray vision to show others what I was working on to disarm a nuke

it allowed them to add their skills rolls as complmentery

[Enforcer84]

Re: High Range Radio Perception with visual display?

 

If HRRP is only to be used by the owner as in the case of a heads up display' date=' then "Affected as more than one sense, sight and hearing as well as radio" is appropriate. Senses are not normally shared by others, to share the sensory data with others, the use of Images would be the best bet.

 

Oh yeah, excellent point!

[CrosshairCollie]

Re: High Range Radio Perception with visual display?

 

I might consider this as a special effect, as it has both an upside and a downside ... yeah, you can show your friends the communications, but any enemies eavesdropping on you can see/hear the whole thing, too.

[bigbywolfe]

Re: High Range Radio Perception with visual display?

 

I might consider this as a special effect' date=' as it has both an upside and a downside ... yeah, you can show your friends the communications, but any enemies eavesdropping on you can see/hear the whole thing, too.[/quote']

 

Only if you have to project it. Perhaps the character can listen to it on his ear piece and watch directly on the watch screen without projecting the image for everyone to see. In that case I think a seperate power or some kind of adder/advantage is needed. If it can only be visibly and audibly projected for everyone to see I could agree that it might be a wash.

[Christopher]

Re: High Range Radio Perception with visual display?

 

I have a question:

What is the differnce from a game balancing perspective?

You basically add the ability that others can hear the same transmission, but you also allow eavesdropping at the same point.

 

The difference between the ability, inability or forced ability (no way to not send in an area) is way below the granularity for hero. Each of the three has it's ups and downsides.

 

 

About the ability to plug in multiple headphones:

Headphones have strong disadvantages: fragile Focus, need one per enduser, limited range to device, limited amount of users.

 

 

Only in on case I could see this requiring a special built:

If you hologram/sound can be seen and heard at close range, but is unintelligible from a range.

Or if the picutre/sound is directly transmitted into peoples heads.

 

This either needs an additional ability for the final Distribution Step (you have to mind link the recepients, before just passing the information through).

Or Useable by Nearby.

 

But even that only if there is a likely game effect.

[Doc Democracy]

Re: High Range Radio Perception with visual display?

 

Hmm. I am wondering if we are getting stuck on SFX and not quite getting to the underlying game mechanic.

 

Essentially you want to share your perception of the world. If you want someone to be able to 'see through your eyes' what power would we use? Mind Link? Clairsentience? Telepathy?

 

Obviously these would all have to come properly limited. I was thinking that you might have a small area effect Telepathy with a focus. So you would be able to transmit your perception to others that were close enough to be able to see the object through which that took place. I chose Telepathy as it is more possible to broadcast to anyone that comes close. I discarded the possibility of perceptions usable by others etc as this means that the perception of everyone is based on the ability of the person that has the HRRP...

 

 

Doc

[Christopher]

Re: High Range Radio Perception with visual display?

 

Obviously these would all have to come properly limited. I was thinking that you might have a small area effect Telepathy with a focus. So you would be able to transmit your perception to others that were close enough to be able to see the object through which that took place. I chose Telepathy as it is more possible to broadcast to anyone that comes close. I discarded the possibility of perceptions usable by others etc as this means that the perception of everyone is based on the ability of the person that has the HRRP...

That would make Televisions and Telephones with Speaker Phones unessesary complex and expensive.

 

The default built for "Closed Camera Circuit System" is just Clairsentience with a Focus. There is no need to buy the ability for multiple guards to look at the same picture at the same time. That is just part of the SFX and how it is defined.

But it also means that the other guy standing invisible in the observation room or using adjacent senses/Clairsentience to eavesdrop into the room will also be able to use the cameras viewpoint.

 

The same way you don't have to buy that a Televisions ability to be hear and seeable by multiple people. It's just defined as a "broadcasting", bulky focus for a sense power (HHRP with limitaitons).

 

All this wrist watch hologram does is increasing the broadcasting cone to a 360° arc and cutting out the bulky part.

[Sean Waters]

Re: High Range Radio Perception with visual display?

 

It is certainly a good point that Christopher makes: if you buy a radio and someone leans in close so they can hear what the guy on the other end is saying too, is that something you should be paying extra points for? Probably not. Unless this is something that is likely to yield regular bonuses or otherwise be significantly abused, it is probably OK to have it 'just work'

 

Bear in mind that soliloquies take no time in the system, so having the GM describe the action to you then having to pass that on in descriptive form to the team seems like an unnecessary extra step. I would probably allow 'others can see what you are seeing' as a reasonably balanced +0 modifier. That could well depend on the rest of the build and would be subject to a 'review' clause once we see how it works in practive, but i can not see a problem from where I am standing.

[Sean Waters]

Re: High Range Radio Perception with visual display?

 

...having said which I have had entire story arcs spawned from a simple mis-communication of something the GM has told a player and then it has been 'chinese whispered' on to the rest.

[Doc Democracy]

Re: High Range Radio Perception with visual display?

 

It is certainly a good point that Christopher makes: if you buy a radio and someone leans in close so they can hear what the guy on the other end is saying too' date=' is that something you should be paying extra points for? Probably not. Unless this is something that is likely to yield regular bonuses or otherwise be significantly abused, it is probably OK to have it 'just work'[/quote']

 

It depends on what you are doing. If you buy a piece of kit then that is one thing. The power comes from the kit and without it you have no access. My misunderstanding was that the hero had radio hearing and wanted to allow others to hear that. In that case, the power exists without the kit and the kit is simply putting it out there for others but only as you have heard it in the first place....that does allow for chinese whispers.

 

Doc

[Christopher]

Re: High Range Radio Perception with visual display?

 

It depends on what you are doing. If you buy a piece of kit then that is one thing. The power comes from the kit and without it you have no access. My misunderstanding was that the hero had radio hearing and wanted to allow others to hear that. In that case' date=' the power exists without the kit and the kit is simply putting it out there for others but only as you have heard it in the first place....that does allow for chinese whispers. [/quote']

What if that kid was a robot? Could a robot with HRRP just turn his ears into microphones and his mouth into a loudspeaker? That way he could broadcast what he recieves (unfiltered) to his allies.

[bigbywolfe]

Re: High Range Radio Perception with visual display?

 

Christopher, your comment on headphones being fragile foci really has nothing to do with it. No one said anything about "off-the-shelf" mundane equipment. Maybe he has an ear piece as part of the same focus (the animated JLA never seem to break their comunicators). Maybe he has a HUD like Iron Man's. Maybe a dozen other things. As to your comment about Hero not being granular enough for the three options you list, let's see: 1. inability to let others see/hear the HRRP. Well, that's the default, and will cost as listed, not that difficult. 2. inability to not let others see/hear it. Most seem to agree that it would probably be equally useful and troublesome. So a +/-0 and the cost is the same. 3. Ability to choose whether to let everyone see/hear or keep HRRP private (and silent and not lit up brightly giving yourself away in the dark, et cetera). You find that to have the same value. I would have to see it in play to know if I think it would be equal, but it seems advantageous to me and a small, heavily limited Image power or even a custom Adder/Advantage on the HRRP might be warented depending on the campaign. Option 3 wuld end up costing a (very) few more points for this flexibility. Where is the horrible granularity problem you are talking about?

[Christopher]

Re: High Range Radio Perception with visual display?

 

(the animated JLA never seem to break their comunicators).

Just compromised by the enemy, or transformed into mind controll devices. And not working in areas that are "communciation shielded".

 

JLU commincator is the classic example of free gear.

 

3. Ability to choose whether to let everyone see/hear or keep HRRP private (and silent and not lit up brightly giving yourself away in the dark' date=' et cetera). You find that to have the same value. I would have to see it in play to know if I think it would be equal, but it seems advantageous to me and a small, heavily limited Image power or even a custom Adder/Advantage on the HRRP might be warented depending on the campaign. Option 3 wuld end up costing a (very) few more points for this flexibility. Where is the horrible granularity problem you are talking about?[/quote']

So in very specific circumstance you might make it cost something. If you think the effect is worth it.

 

This is the exception that profes the rule. The 5% of cases in wich every rule could be wrong.

[bigbywolfe]

Re: High Range Radio Perception with visual display?

 

Just compromised by the enemy' date=' or transformed into mind controll devices. And not working in areas that are "communciation shielded".JLU commincator is the classic example of free gear.So in very specific circumstance you [i']might[/i] make it cost something. If you think the effect is worth it.This is the exception that profes the rule. The 5% of cases in wich every rule could be wrong.

Well it is the same position I had when you claimed the system wasn't granular enough. You seem to be unable to defend that position and instead respond with essentially "I'm right 95% of the time, which basically means you're wrong." It is not even related to your former argument, so I wonder if you even have a problem with my position or if you are just determined to be "right". For what it is worth, IME option #2 is just as uncommon as #3, and so is just as much of an edge case. Thus #1is the majority that "makes the rule". Well duh, it's the default use of the power, of course it is going to outway the other edge cases, whether the edge cases cost the same or different has nothing to do with the percentages.

[Christopher]

Re: High Range Radio Perception with visual display?

 

Well it is the same position I had when you claimed the system wasn't granular enough. You seem to be unable to defend that position and instead respond with essentially "I'm right 95% of the time' date=' which basically means you're wrong."[/quote']

From my point of view you tried to proof that I am wrong. Wich failed, by being relying on every specific curcimstances.

[bigbywolfe]

Re: High Range Radio Perception with visual display?

 

I didn't try to "proof" anything. My position has been the same since my first post, I would do it with the Image power. I would still do it with an Image build, even though I acknowledged that it may be okay to just be SFX if there is an penalty equal to the benifit. I didn't rely on some edge case after you claimed the system isn't granular enough, my position was that there was a benifit to having it built as a seperate power before you claimed that.

[NuSoardGraphite]

Re: High Range Radio Perception with visual display?

 

I agree with the Images concept. That is essentially what a Television is. There is equipment in the TV that receives the radio signal. This is the HRRP power. There is additional equipment in the TV that turns that signal into video and audio image that can be viewed by others. That is the Images power.

[Doc Democracy]

Re: High Range Radio Perception with visual display?

 

What if that kid was a robot? Could a robot with HRRP just turn his ears into microphones and his mouth into a loudspeaker? That way he could broadcast what he recieves (unfiltered) to his allies.

 

That is all SFX justification Christopher. If the kid was a robot then what he could do would depend on the powers bought. However, if the robot displayed what he recieves then what everyone else saw would depend on the perception of the robot. he is not giving the power for others to use, he is simply displaying what he percieves using that hardware.

 

Doc

[Sean Waters]

Re: High Range Radio Perception with visual display?

 

It depends on what you are doing. If you buy a piece of kit then that is one thing. The power comes from the kit and without it you have no access. My misunderstanding was that the hero had radio hearing and wanted to allow others to hear that. In that case, the power exists without the kit and the kit is simply putting it out there for others but only as you have heard it in the first place....that does allow for chinese whispers.

 

Doc

 

I understand the logic of that but 'focus' is a limitation and should not really be giving you advantages that you don't get from the base power.

 

That aside, I don't think that being able to share what you perceive with HRRH with those in your immediate vicinity is likely to cause any imbalance problems. If you could share your N-Ray vision, then clearly it would.

 

In that instance I might consider the UBO advantage rather than a separate power to communicate the information.

[Sean Waters]

Re: High Range Radio Perception with visual display?

 

Build note: the advantage of 'images' is that anyone can perceive them, and any number of people can perceive them (this can also cause problems, of course), whereas, with UBO, you have to specify a maximum number who can share in the power.

 

I come back to wondering what imbalance problems are likely to occur if you allow this though: OK it cuts out some chinese whisper fun (but a clever GM can always arrange for the character to get a transmission whilst alone) but it moves the game on a bit quicker than having to take the player out of the room to explain what they see. Realistically how many of you actually split players up when their characters wonder into parts of a map where they can not see the same things?