Ragitsu Posted May 2, 2012 Report Share Posted May 2, 2012 I'm gearing up soldiers in an alternate-history game of mine, but want to avoid conventional weaponry for the sake of flavour. So far, I have the Heckler and Koch G11 as their rifle of choice, but am stumped in terms of sidearm, machine gun, and grenades. I need weapons that are innovative (perhaps better in some ways), but didn't catch on in "our" timeline for whatever reasons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manic Typist Posted May 3, 2012 Report Share Posted May 3, 2012 Re: Alternate History Trooper Loadout? Hm....needle weapons? (Fletchee? Something like that?) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zen Archer Posted May 3, 2012 Report Share Posted May 3, 2012 Re: Alternate History Trooper Loadout? Flechettes, you mean? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flechette Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hyper-Man Posted May 3, 2012 Report Share Posted May 3, 2012 Re: Alternate History Trooper Loadout? What's the historical divergence? Who are the superpower(s)? The world powers of the WWII era all had different military hardware philosophies that impacted the outcome of the war (USA - overwhelming production with constant upgrades; Russia - desperate mass production to put manpower advantage to use at any cost; Germany - constantly going for tech high ground until allied bombing took out production capacity; UK - most efficient use of what little resources they had; Japan - similar to Russian philosophy with regard to manpower but heavier focus on naval hardware, all with focus on securing long term supplies) The United States has since co-opted the German tech high ground philosophy but other Countries may not have done the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beast Posted May 3, 2012 Report Share Posted May 3, 2012 Re: Alternate History Trooper Loadout? SMG P90 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FN_P90 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ragitsu Posted May 3, 2012 Author Report Share Posted May 3, 2012 Re: Alternate History Trooper Loadout? Hm....needle weapons? (Fletchee? Something like that?) Flechettes, you mean? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flechette Are there flechette firing weapons of note? If so, do you guys have any suggestions on which to use? What's the historical divergence? Who are the superpower(s)? The world powers of the WWII era all had different military hardware philosophies that impacted the outcome of the war (USA - overwhelming production with constant upgrades; Russia - desperate mass production to put manpower advantage to use at any cost; Germany - constantly going for tech high ground until allied bombing took out production capacity; UK - most efficient use of what little resources they had; Japan - similar to Russian philosophy with regard to manpower but heavier focus on naval hardware' date=' all with focus on securing long term supplies) The United States has since co-opted the German tech high ground philosophy but other Countries may not have done the same.[/quote'] The divergence occurred in 1983. The year is currently 2005. In terms of superpowers, the political climate is about the same. SMG P90 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FN_P90 While it's a nifty firearm, at least the P90 found a niche and wasn't the victim of politics or lack of funding. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Democracy Posted May 3, 2012 Report Share Posted May 3, 2012 Re: Alternate History Trooper Loadout? If you want it to be obviously different then why not look for a brand name that is not associated with weaponry today but some corporate decision in 1985 caused, for example, Chevrolet to take up handgun manufacture? So you might have a 45 calibre Chevvy Sabre as a sidearm. Doc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Markdoc Posted May 3, 2012 Report Share Posted May 3, 2012 Re: Alternate History Trooper Loadout? Another possibility is the Steyr weapons system. The Steyr AUG is pretty popular with users and has seen plenty of use over the last 30 years: the Aussies have just decided to go with the updated Steyr as their new core weapon. Back in the day, there was interest in the modular approach Steyr used: in many ways, it was a forerunner of the now-defunct US XM28 program, and it was certainly an inspiration. Add to that the fact that it looks "different" and it should have the desired effect. cheers, Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manic Typist Posted May 3, 2012 Report Share Posted May 3, 2012 Re: Alternate History Trooper Loadout? Are there flechette firing weapons of note? If so, do you guys have any suggestions on which to use? Rather than are, don't you mean "could there have been?" It seems that there were sabot flechette rounds available for the M16 around the time of Vietnam, for example. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Carman Posted May 3, 2012 Report Share Posted May 3, 2012 Re: Alternate History Trooper Loadout? If you want it to be obviously different then why not look for a brand name that is not associated with weaponry today but some corporate decision in 1985 caused, for example, Chevrolet to take up handgun manufacture? So you might have a 45 calibre Chevvy Sabre as a sidearm. Doc Did you know that Chrysler built the Redstone and Jupiter rockets, and the first stage of the Saturn I (which was effectively a Jupiter kerosene tank surrounded by 8 Redstone LOX tanks)? Their submission to the shuttle design competition (SERV) was one of the most radical: a giant semi-conical single-stage-to-orbit rocket with a vertical-landing capability. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sundog Posted May 3, 2012 Report Share Posted May 3, 2012 Re: Alternate History Trooper Loadout? The only stand out Flechette firing weapon I know of is the Steyr ACR (Advanced Combat Rifle). http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steyr_ACR Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OMEGAop Posted May 3, 2012 Report Share Posted May 3, 2012 Re: Alternate History Trooper Loadout? what about the Colt Scamp http://media.photobucket.com/image/colt%20scamp/jasongregg/coltscamprender2.jpg http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colt_SCAMP Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sundog Posted May 3, 2012 Report Share Posted May 3, 2012 Re: Alternate History Trooper Loadout? Nice catch, didn't know about that one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freakboy6117 Posted May 4, 2012 Report Share Posted May 4, 2012 Re: Alternate History Trooper Loadout? how about going with gyro-jets that's a whole weapon system that never really caught on slight improvmenst in manufacturing materials or propellants might have made them a legit option Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ragitsu Posted May 8, 2012 Author Report Share Posted May 8, 2012 Re: Alternate History Trooper Loadout? Why haven't 10mm weapons been more prolific? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sundog Posted May 8, 2012 Report Share Posted May 8, 2012 Re: Alternate History Trooper Loadout? Why haven't 10mm weapons been more prolific? Several reasons. First, there's consumer conservatism - with high-price items (such as guns) the general public is more likely to go with what they know, barring a clear advantage. Second, 10mm is a solution in search of a problem - for large-capacity, easy fire guns we already have 9mm, and for heavier hitting we already have .45ACP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadow Hawk Posted May 8, 2012 Report Share Posted May 8, 2012 Re: Alternate History Trooper Loadout? What if, instead of going for the cooler, more modern(istic) weapon, they had stayed old school? There was a large arguement in the U.S./Nato sphere over handguns: the 9mm (favored by Europeans, longer ranged, more accurate, bigger magazine) or the .45 (more damage per hit, knockdown). In the 'real' world, Nato won and the U.S. eventually (with much resistance) switched to the 9mm. What if the U.S. infantry officers had won, and the .45 M1911 was now the standard sidearm? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ragitsu Posted May 9, 2012 Author Report Share Posted May 9, 2012 Re: Alternate History Trooper Loadout? There was a large arguement in the U.S./Nato sphere over handguns: the 9mm (favored by Europeans' date=' longer ranged, more accurate, bigger magazine) or the .45 (more damage per hit, knockdown). In the 'real' world, Nato won and the U.S. eventually (with much resistance) switched to the 9mm. What if the U.S. infantry officers had won, and the .45 M1911 was now the standard sidearm?[/quote'] The problem with this, is that the Colt 1911 isn't unknown by any means. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Man Posted May 10, 2012 Report Share Posted May 10, 2012 Re: Alternate History Trooper Loadout? . What if the U.S. infantry officers had won' date=' and the .45 M1911 was now the standard sidearm?[/quote'] Then the world would be stuck with an overhyped, near-subsonic round for the sidearms they never use. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ragitsu Posted May 10, 2012 Author Report Share Posted May 10, 2012 Re: Alternate History Trooper Loadout? how about going with gyro-jets that's a whole weapon system that never really caught on slight improvmenst in manufacturing materials or propellants might have made them a legit option I don't envision the typical trooper being armed with a gyroc pistol. In what role do you envision them being practical? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hyper-Man Posted May 10, 2012 Report Share Posted May 10, 2012 Re: Alternate History Trooper Loadout? ..... In what role do you envision them being practical? That's the kind of question that goes back to my previous post. The definition of "Practical" depends on the political-social-economic standards of the world. If they are essentially the same as our world then there is little reason for the weapons to be different. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex Williamson Posted May 17, 2012 Report Share Posted May 17, 2012 Re: Alternate History Trooper Loadout? The CAWS (Close Assault Weapon System) program was developed for the US Navy - it fired special 12 ga rounds with 12 flechettes: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heckler_%26_Koch_HK_CAWS It's a badass auto shotgun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Susano Posted May 18, 2012 Report Share Posted May 18, 2012 Re: Alternate History Trooper Loadout? In Digital Hero issue 10 I had an article called "The 50 Million Dollar Man" in the Future Solider project. It included a lot of gear you might find useful. I also updated the gear for 6E and included it in Kazei 5 from BlackWyrm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freakboy6117 Posted May 19, 2012 Report Share Posted May 19, 2012 Re: Alternate History Trooper Loadout? A world where more space or underwater exploration and collonization take place then a marine style force might make use of a weapon that would work in many enironments as would extra dimensional explorers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ragitsu Posted June 14, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 Re: Alternate History Trooper Loadout? The CAWS (Close Assault Weapon System) program was developed for the US Navy - it fired special 12 ga rounds with 12 flechettes: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heckler_%26_Koch_HK_CAWS It's a badass auto shotgun. Automatic shotguns may just be niche enough to qualify . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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