Monkey Grip

[Markdoc]

Re: Monkey Grip

 

But, building the "Special" halberd with points and OAF doesn't necissarily mean it's a one time thing. It could be his special power, bought OIF (Halbred of Opporotunity Or even 2 handed weapon of opporotunity) You're buying the special bit with the weapon not the weapon itself

 

Precisely. Monkey Grip as a talent would simply be costed as though it included "OIF: 2-handed weapon of opportunity"

 

I hate to ask' date=' and maybe I missed it... why didn't you just buy Sword Muscles, Extra STR, Only for Wielding Two-Handed Weapons 1 Handed, (-1 1/2)?[/quote']

 

Cause the rules specifically forbid it? The GM could of course allow it, but allowing people to wield two handed weapons in one hand has significant consequences - not only does it boost damage (while still allowing shield use) but it boosts BASE damage - letting you add twice the difference. Since in heroic games, rDEF is usually limited, altering weapon damage can have major knock on effects.

 

cheers, Mark

[Killer Shrike]

Re: Monkey Grip

 

There are many ways to do this, as already indicated by the deluge of answers.

 

However, the rules themselves tell you how to do it under the "Required Hands" explanation under Weapons & Armor -- on page 479 of 5th Edition Revised.

 

The short version is, it takes +3 STR to wield a two handed weapon with 1 hand, assuming its possible at all (bows and pole arms are specifically mentioned as usually not being possible at all).

[Thia Halmades]

Re: Monkey Grip

 

There are many ways to do this, as already indicated by the deluge of answers.

 

However, the rules themselves tell you how to do it under the "Required Hands" explanation under Weapons & Armor -- on page 479 of 5th Edition Revised.

 

The short version is, it takes +3 STR to wield a two handed weapon with 1 hand, assuming its possible at all (bows and pole arms are specifically mentioned as usually not being possible at all).

 

Right, like I said; buy extra STR, "Only for wielding two-handed weapons in one hand. (-1 1/2)." It's like Gun Muscles. And there are so many ways to add damage in this game I can't imagine this being a huge deal.

[Killer Shrike]

Re: Monkey Grip

 

Right' date=' like I said; buy extra STR, "Only for wielding two-handed weapons in one hand. (-1 1/2)." It's like Gun Muscles. And there are so many ways to add damage in this game I can't imagine this being a huge deal.[/quote']

 

You don't even have to do that (unless you _only_ want to overcome the two-handed requirement). If you have a two-handed weapon w/ a STR Min of 15, its one handed STR Min is 18 -- any 18 STR (or greater) character can wield it in such a fashion unless the GM protests.

[Thia Halmades]

Re: Monkey Grip

 

You don't even have to do that (unless you _only_ want to overcome the two-handed requirement). If you have a two-handed weapon w/ a STR Min of 15' date=' its one handed STR Min is 18 -- any 18 STR (or greater) character can wield it in such a fashion unless the GM protests.[/quote']

 

Agreed, but the reason I mention it is because the cat was specifically looking for a 'Feat' in which to do it, and that Super Skill from DC is Gun Muscles, which is Extra STR, only to wield (whatever). Since it's only to make 2-Handed Weapons 1 handed, your +5 STR will cost 2 points. However, you're absolutely correct.

[MorpheousXO]

Re: Monkey Grip

 

Yup, either go +STR or the more expensive naked advantage type way. Considdering what the rules say, the +STR makes more sense.

[Captain Obvious]

Re: Monkey Grip

 

Extra Limb (5), invisible (+1), only for weilding two-handed weapons in one hand (-1), real cost: 5

 

Mike

 

This seems to cover all bases, and do it quite simply. This is how I would do it.

[Thia Halmades]

Re: Monkey Grip

 

That's just weird. It works, which is why I play HERO, but it's weird.

[AmadanNaBriona]

Re: Monkey Grip

 

That's just weird. It works' date=' which is why I play HERO, but it's weird.[/quote']

nowhere near as weird as a Naked buy-down of the weapons handedness limitation with a Focus of Opportunity lim.

 

I'd go with the extra limb too, because this is an odd situation...it's to overcome a systemic limitation (No 2H polearms useable 1H, even with Extra STR) that doesn't have a point cost/value or writeup, so an alternate workaround needs to be found.

This seems the simplest.

[Wyrm Ouroboros]

Re: Monkey Grip

 

Since the real cost of the halberd in FH is 59 points the two handed disadvantage is worth (59 - (59 / 1.5)) 20 points, then taking the -1 'halberd only' disadvantage on the 20 points is (20 / 2) 10 points.

 

.... Rook, you totally poxed your mathematics in the first place. You do NOT apply a disadvantage, figure out the cost, then apply another disadvantage to that cost and figure out the cost again. All your Disads apply all at once.

 

This build from the Fantasy Weapons and Armor HDP Prefab:

 

Halberd: (Total: 59 Active Cost, 18 Real Cost) Killing Attack - Hand-To-Hand 2d6+1 (vs. PD) (4 DEF, 6 BODY, L, Set, Unhorse), Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2) (52 Active Points); OAF (-1), STR Minimum 17 (-3/4), Required Hands Two-Handed (-1/2), Real Weapon (-1/4) (Real Cost: 15) plus Stretching 1", Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2) (7 Active Points); OAF (-1), no Noncombat Stretching (-1/4) (Real Cost: 3)

 

52 Active Points is what you're working with. You want a skill that removes 'Required Hands: Two-Handed (-1/2)' on a halberd. That's 2 points -- 15 (as above), then removing -1/2 from the 'current' -2.5 Disad total you have. Therefore, your feat should go one of two ways:

 

+2 PSLs vs. One-Handed Use of Two-Handed Weapon (3 Active Points); Halberd Only (-1/2), 2 Points.

 

OR

 

+3 STR, (3 Active Points); Only for One-Handed Use of Two-Handed Weapons (-1/2), Halberd Only (-1/2), 1 Point.

 

Essentially, it's a 2-point skill, Feat, Power, whatever you want to call it. The reason why I applied 'Halberd Only' at a -1/2 is because I'd guess the Halberd is his primary weapon; it isn't much of a penalty since he always has it handy. As for the 'Only for One-Handed use...', yes, perhaps you WOULD get more out of it otherwise -- but really, this is a particular trick, and honestly, it's still only gonna be 1 bloody point. He wants to do it for all weapons, fine -- 2 points. Whichever.

 

Myself, I'd have the player do it as PSLs.

[jaws]

Re: Monkey Grip

 

I actually have a character, Dwarf that does that with his dwarven war axe and used the precise mechanics suggested by Thia and KS. Ben playing around with it for a few sessions and it works out just fine and is not unbalancing. So far at least.

 

Especially since I cost STR at 2 points per point.

 

However wielding a pole arm one handed just seems weird. It is long and unwieldy with a heavy end. I guess you would have to go with the "Invisible Extra limb" however... unless you are looking for a kung fu style martial arts weapons wielder ... with out shields usually ... it sounds more like a player just trying to stretch the rules a little more.

[Killer Shrike]

Re: Monkey Grip

 

On the subject of polearms, its such a diverse group, and some of them are multi-purpose to boot, that I'd hardly call it cut and dried. A halberd, for instance, is basically an axe-spear. They also vary in length -- some are quite long and others are basically long-hafted axes with a pointy cap.

 

A GM might make a different call from "halberd to halberd' as it were based upon the specific weapon in question and the intended one handed use.

 

For instance, a GM might allow a halberd to be swung one-handed as an axe, but not as a spear.

 

Another point to consider in general for polearms (and staffs for that matter) is a trade off between reach and handedness -- perhaps by "choking up" on the haft at or near the balance point its possible to wield one clumsily at -1 OCV and without reach using the STR MIN +3 clause.

 

A good starting place is to remember that the HERO System generally favors "cinematic" over "realistic" unless the GM is turning options on and off to tone it down. A GM running a more gritty, "real" game like Markdoc should likely err on the side of strictness, and a GM running a more "cinematic" game should likely err on the side of looseness.

 

Its also important to remember that the rules are a framework, not a straight jacket, and that while there are exceptions (I've been known to make some twisted constructs myself), if you find yourself getting too convoluted to overcome something, you're probably not on the right path.