Anyone using 1 pt per Dex in 6E?

[薔薇語]

Re: Anyone using 1 pt per Dex in 6E?

 

When it comes to DEX, I would just as soon break out the initiative aspect and make Dex only count towards Agil skills. Let Lightning reflexes be the soul decider of initiative. In essence, LR is 1:1 (i.e., half of the cost of DEX).

 

La Rose.

[Matt Holck]

Re: Anyone using 1 pt per Dex in 6E?

 

http://muppet.wikia.com/wiki/The_Swedish_Chef

 

a shmear gemoost tu mir

initiative to steer

max speed the lead on the dodge

dive! block! bort!

[Sean Waters]

Re: Anyone using 1 pt per Dex in 6E?

 

Thanks for all your insights.

 

I almost feel like the 6 base stats should be 2 points each, but I'm sure everyone would be up in arms about that. If 1 point each means everyone just takes 20 (in heroic campaigns) or otherwise has unreasonably high stats, it means the stats are priced too cheaply.

 

Strength is definitely underpriced at 1 point per point...

 

...but...

 

it works as it is. That could be because we instinctively adjust to make it work...and it also means that superheroes would be massively reduced in efficacy: we would be halving what Superman could lift. There's ways around that. They have been suggested.

 

The only real way out of this, to be honest, is get rid of characteristics completely. Good at Agility Skills? Buy Aglity Skill Levels. Want to be quick? Buy Lightning Reflexes. Etc, etc...

[dmjalund]

Re: Anyone using 1 pt per Dex in 6E?

 

Strength is definitely underpriced at 1 point per point...

 

...but...

 

it works as it is. That could be because we instinctively adjust to make it work...and it also means that superheroes would be massively reduced in efficacy: we would be halving what Superman could lift. There's ways around that. They have been suggested.

 

The only real way out of this, to be honest, is get rid of characteristics completely. Good at Agility Skills? Buy Aglity Skill Levels. Want to be quick? Buy Lightning Reflexes. Etc, etc...

Have lift be purchaseable separately

[Vondy]

Re: Anyone using 1 pt per Dex in 6E?

 

I almost feel like the 6 base stats should be 2 points each....

 

You are not alone.

[Markdoc]

Re: Anyone using 1 pt per Dex in 6E?

 

You are not alone.

 

Hmmmm. That's actually a pretty good idea. Might be worth considering for my next game.

 

cheers, Mark

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: Anyone using 1 pt per Dex in 6E?

 

Heres 1 vote for reinstituting NCM as default for Heroic Campaigns

 

That exacerbates the problem. If skill levels are priced on the assumption of double cost for NCM stats, they become vastly overpriced in games where the cost does not double (even in NCM games, why buy levels with interaction skills if you haven't hit the NCM cap yet - all people skilled at interaction must have an 18 PRE to be cost-effective if NCM kicks in at 20). If the price is based on normal stat costs, skill levels are bargain priced in an NCM model.

 

For NCM to work, it needs to be more broadly extended, increasing the costs of more than just characteristics, or we need to reconsider how we build abilities that enhance aspects of a characteristic (and get rid of "limited characteristics are powers and not subject to NCM").

 

The only real way out of this' date=' to be honest, is get rid of characteristics completely. Good at Agility Skills? Buy Aglity Skill Levels. Want to be quick? Buy Lightning Reflexes. Etc, etc...[/quote']

 

I don't think we have to get rid of characteristics. We could, instead, eliminate abilities that simulate aspects of characteristics and apply limitations to characteristics to rebuild these. Good at Interaction skills? Maybe +1 to all rolls based on PRE is a -1 limitation on PRE. That needs to be a bigger limitation, maybe -1 1/2, if you can only enhance one roll in a phase, and perhaps it's -2 if you can only enhance a single PRE based roll. PRE attacks and PRE defense would also need their own limitations. The cost of +5 PRE only for skill rolls, +5 PRE only for PRE attacks and +5 PRE, only for PRE defense should sum up to about the same as +5 PRE, or a bit more for rounding.

 

Trying to set the limitations and judge the results is a pretty good way of persuading yourself that many characteristics may be underpriced in the existing model.

[Ockham's Spoon]

Re: Anyone using 1 pt per Dex in 6E?

 

I would say that the price for various CHA might not be quite right, but I wouldn't say anything is broken. Besides which I think it depends on to some extent what genre you are playing (and who you are playing with). I have had fantasy games where STR was 2:1 and that worked just fine, but building the Hulk with STR priced like that would be somewhat punitive.

 

The argument for decoupling skills from CHA altogether does have some logical basis. But for my tastes it makes good "game sense" that your really smart character is just inherently good at INT-based skills or that your high DEX guy masters agility skills easily. In the real world practice is almost always more important than innate ability, but cinematically heroes are just good.

[Ice9]

Re: Anyone using 1 pt per Dex in 6E?

 

I've changed it, on the basis that INT (and thus PER) are 1:1. This may not apply to all campaigns, but IME, being surprised (or not) is as big a deciding factor in combat as initiative.

 

I do think skill levels are a bit overpriced relative to stats (or vice versa). Honestly, for the price, skill levels should apply to all relevant skills simultaneously, not just one at a time. Even then, they're not always a good buy.

[MorpheousXO]

Re: Anyone using 1 pt per Dex in 6E?

 

Ok, so let's consider: if we decide to modify Skill levels so that they apply to all relevant skill simultaneously, what kind of ripple affect does that have?

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: Anyone using 1 pt per Dex in 6E?

 

Well, it means we need a lower cost skill level that applies to only one roll at a time.

 

I think skill levels would still be overpriced at 4 points. For INT, this implies +1 to all PER rolls is worth 1 point. For PRE, it implies +1d6 PRE attacks and +5 PRE defense are worth a total of 1 point.

 

Ignoring the issue of pricing characteristics, we could simply set the value of enhancing skill rolls at half the benefits of the characteristic, so a skill level becomes half the cost of +5 to the characteristic (or a -1 limitation on the characteristic). The other benefits of the characteristic, without enhancing skill rolls, would then make up the other half of the cost (so a -1 limitation to get just those benefits).

 

I'd rather see PRE defense be a function of EGO instead of PRE (maybe that makes PRE defense similar to resisting mental attacks). I think that would work better (and if we reprice PRE and INT at 2 points to match DEX, we can reasonably leave EGO alone since EGO rolls are less common, leaving PRE defense less expensive than PRE attacks).