How to: Spatial Compression technology

[megaplayboy]

In Doctor Who, the TARDIS is actually this ginormous ship, but only a tiny portion of it appears/exists in our reality, AIUI. In Dragon Ball and Dragon Ball Z, the Capsule Corporation has perfected a technology which enables vehicles and even homes to be compressed into a small, lightweight capsule and then activated/deployed with a button press and a toss when needed.

In Ultraviolet, the heroine has tech which enables her to access stored weaponry when needed, and her associate helps her by driving around in a large mobile base which is contained in a truck-sized vehicle.

 

All of these are examples of "spatial compression" or "dimensional storage". I have some ideas about how to model this in Hero System, but am curious as to how folks here would do it.

[Rapier]

Re: How to: Spatial Compression technology

 

All of these are examples of "spatial compression" or "dimensional storage". I have some ideas about how to model this in Hero System' date=' but am curious as to how folks here would do it. [/quote']

 

For the most part, call if SFX and let it ride.

 

For the Ultraviolet style of 'portable holing' your weapons, does it matter if you are drawing your weapon from a holster or this portable hole? No. No costs/build for holsters so no cost/build for porty holes.

 

For a Tardis, your base/vehicle is still built upon Size X. You've already paid for the size. There is no cost differential for real estate, so that a wider base costs more than a taller base. If there is no cost differential for alter the proportion of dimensions, just have one of those dimensions be another 'dimension!'

 

If the base being extra dimensional is going to be some kind of vital plot point, I suppose you could add an EDM UAA (or UBO) Triggered upon passing through the door or something.

 

In the end, there is no need to try and develop/shoe horn a power constuct for the effect you are trying to achieve. It is merely the SFX of the power.

[megaplayboy]

Re: How to: Spatial Compression technology

 

For the most part, call if SFX and let it ride.

 

For the Ultraviolet style of 'portable holing' your weapons, does it matter if you are drawing your weapon from a holster or this portable hole? No. No costs/build for holsters so no cost/build for porty holes.

 

For a Tardis, your base/vehicle is still built upon Size X. You've already paid for the size. There is no cost differential for real estate, so that a wider base costs more than a taller base. If there is no cost differential for alter the proportion of dimensions, just have one of those dimensions be another 'dimension!'

 

If the base being extra dimensional is going to be some kind of vital plot point, I suppose you could add an EDM UAA (or UBO) Triggered upon passing through the door or something.

 

In the end, there is no need to try and develop/shoe horn a power constuct for the effect you are trying to achieve. It is merely the SFX of the power.

 

Ah. I should clarify a few things, I guess.

1. In Ultraviolet, the technology can be used to store a very large number of weapons (more than a person could lift, let's say). These weapons weigh nothing and do not encumber the user until summoned for use. (You could literally carry around a ton of weapons without difficulty).

The other benefit is, without proper detection equipment, the weapons are perfectly concealed from outside observers.

2. In DBZ, 2 story homes, motorcycles, even large airplanes are compressed into capsules than can fit into the palm of one's hand, carried with minimal encumbrance, and then deployed quickly for use.

3. Vehicles and bases which contain more interior size than that indicated are in effect, at the very least, concealing that additional size from outside observation/detection. If the TARDIS' real size is the equivalent of a Borg cube, say, then having it appear externally to be the size of a phone booth obviously conveys some tangible benefit. Ditto for a truck whose interior is the size of a warehouse.

 

All of these things do seem to convey tangible benefits, above and beyond sfx.

[Sean Waters]

Re: How to: Spatial Compression technology

 

It seems to me that this is one of the very few valid uses for EDM.

[Markdoc]

Re: How to: Spatial Compression technology

 

Depending on how it works, I see four solutions.

 

For the pocket armory, a "gadget pool" with a reduced focus limitation (OIF, probably). I had a teleporting character who had this. He could teleport to himself any object he had stored at a memorised location, so he had an essentially endless supply of "stuff" that he could essentially pull out of his pocket.

 

For a vehicle or base which is larger inside than out, EDM or shrinking UAA, area affect, continuous (if you move into a continuous area affect you are affected, no to hit roll needed) depending on taste.

 

For the collapsed-to-pocket-size jumbo jets: summon, with a focus, one recoverable charge.

 

cheers, Mark

[nexus]

Re: How to: Spatial Compression technology

 

Ah. I should clarify a few things, I guess.

1. In Ultraviolet, the technology can be used to store a very large number of weapons (more than a person could lift, let's say). These weapons weigh nothing and do not encumber the user until summoned for use. (You could literally carry around a ton of weapons without difficulty).

 

Yeah, at one point she's carrying around a kid of 10 or so in a unit thin as a book and about the size of back pack with the same weight.

 

Possibly a Gadget/Weapon pool changeable in Combat with a OIF and other limitations to reflect it's nature. Make the points expendable, that is if she loses or empties a weapon she has to buy it again or wait until she can "refill" her pool at an appropriate locationl.

 

The other benefit is, without proper detection equipment, the weapons are perfectly concealed from outside observers

 

Hmm, Invisible to Weapon Detection or huge Concealment Bonus?

 

.

2. In DBZ, 2 story homes, motorcycles, even large airplanes are compressed into capsules than can fit into the palm of one's hand, carried with minimal encumbrance, and then deployed quickly for use.

 

Summon: Base or Vehicle?

 

Simple structures might be doable with Barrier?

 

3. Vehicles and bases which contain more interior size than that indicated are in effect, at the very least, concealing that additional size from outside observation/detection. If the TARDIS' real size is the equivalent of a Borg cube, say, then having it appear externally to be the size of a phone booth obviously conveys some tangible benefit. Ditto for a truck whose interior is the size of a warehouse. All of these things do seem to convey tangible benefits, above and beyond sfx.

 

The object in question (Tardis, the vehicle, etc) is just a OIF or has EDM to an Extra Dimensional Base.

 

Just some suggestions. I hope they help.

[megaplayboy]

Re: How to: Spatial Compression technology

 

Depending on how it works, I see four solutions.

 

For the pocket armory, a "gadget pool" with a reduced focus limitation (OIF, probably). I had a teleporting character who had this. He could teleport to himself any object he had stored at a memorised location, so he had an essentially endless supply of "stuff" that he could essentially pull out of his pocket.

 

For a vehicle or base which is larger inside than out, EDM or shrinking UAA, area affect, continuous (if you move into a continuous area affect you are affected, no to hit roll needed) depending on taste.

 

For the collapsed-to-pocket-size jumbo jets: summon, with a focus, one recoverable charge.

 

cheers, Mark

 

I think the EDM or shrinking UAA could also be used for the capsules--6 levels of 6e shrinking reduces a 25 ton object down to a few ounces in mass, the sfx would be that the object was shrunk down and contained inside the capsule, and the shrinking would be turned off once the button was pressed and a few seconds elapsed. Ditto for EDM, except the power would be activated at the compression site, then pushing the button summons the object back from the other dimension.

 

Other mechanical benefits to the weapon pool might be lots of extra clips or 0 END on firearms, a concealment bonus for hiding weapons, etc.

 

Could you buy the extra SIZ for a vehicle/base, with an advantage Invisible Power Effects, and a +0 limitation, no mass/KB benefits?

 

The only problem with the Summon approach to the vehicle/base thing is that you'd have to handwave the "summoned being/object disappears after tasks completed" aspect of Summon. Plus it's a pretty expensive way to buy a vehicle, since you have to take a +1 on it to begin with.

[Jhamin]

Re: How to: Spatial Compression technology

 

Could you buy the extra SIZ for a vehicle/base' date=' with an advantage Invisible Power Effects, and a +0 limitation, no mass/KB benefits?[/quote']

 

I'm fairly sure this is how the "Time Travel Capsule" was written up in the Ultimate Vehicle for 5th edition.

 

As for carrying more gear than you really can? Sounds like the SFX of having paid points for lots of different attacks.

The 4th edition Harbinger of Justice had an "extradimensional gun warehouse" VPP. He could summon most any gun he needed from his EDM space, use it, then trade it out for something else. It was pretty much a straight VPP, only for attacks -1/2. The EDM part of it was just SFX.

[prestidigitator]

Re: How to: Spatial Compression technology

 

For a Base or Vehicle I would probably buy up its Size with Invisible Power Effects and add DCV to counteract the OCV bonus it grants attackers.

[culhwch]

Re: How to: Spatial Compression technology

 

I'm fairly sure this is how the "Time Travel Capsule" was written up in the Ultimate Vehicle for 5th edition.

 

 

That is the Ultimate Vehicle does it. Although Hero Designer complains about it when I open the HD file for the Time Travel Capsule for UV, so maybe not strictly legal?

[Jhamin]

Re: How to: Spatial Compression technology

 

That is the Ultimate Vehicle does it. Although Hero Designer complains about it when I open the HD file for the Time Travel Capsule for UV' date=' so maybe not strictly legal?[/quote']

 

I don't think Hero Designer was designed to like putting power advantages on the Size statistic of a Vehicle. It *is* a fairly unusual thing to do. But in general the published writeups are a more direct source of what is and isn't legal than what causes Hero Designer to complain.

[Rapier]

Re: How to: Spatial Compression technology

 

Ah. I should clarify a few things, I guess.

1. In Ultraviolet, the technology can be used to store a very large number of weapons (more than a person could lift, let's say). These weapons weigh nothing and do not encumber the user until summoned for use. (You could literally carry around a ton of weapons without difficulty).

The other benefit is, without proper detection equipment, the weapons are perfectly concealed from outside observers.

 

Now that you mention it, that does ring a bell. However, in this case as long as all the powers have been purchased (or bought in an Equipment Pool), it is still SFX. If you wanted to you could go with the backpack route and say that there is a "container" that has +10 STR Only for Carrying Equipment Inside.

 

2. In DBZ, 2 story homes, motorcycles, even large airplanes are compressed into capsules than can fit into the palm of one's hand, carried with minimal encumbrance, and then deployed quickly for use.

 

If you are talking about throwing out your arms in the middle of a park and magically creating your car/truck/house? Summon. I would say that is a CLASSIC example of the main purpose of Summon. Keep in mind that you can't double dip and get the cost break for Base/Vehicle AND the cost break for Summon. Build the base/vehicle and then Summon that 'character.'

 

3. Vehicles and bases which contain more interior size than that indicated are in effect, at the very least, concealing that additional size from outside observation/detection. If the TARDIS' real size is the equivalent of a Borg cube, say, then having it appear externally to be the size of a phone booth obviously conveys some tangible benefit. Ditto for a truck whose interior is the size of a warehouse.

 

Still SFX. The building I live in is concealing the interior contents from the outside. For all someone knows I could have a disco hall, a shooting range, a movie studio or maybe just a plain old house inside. The only time I might be tempted to stat up a power for the ability is if it is possible for people who inhabit the other dimension to stumble into it.

 

All of these things do seem to convey tangible benefits, above and beyond sfx.

 

Not really. At least, not to the degree that it should pay points. For instance, you've already paid points to have a base that covers 4000 m^2. Do you have to pay more points if it is 10 floors of 400 m^2? Is it more points if it's downtown as opposed to the middle of Death Valley? Having a base in the middle of downtown would provide much more tangible benefits than one in Death Valley (as long as there is good take away within walking distance).

 

SFX.

[Ice9]

Re: How to: Spatial Compression technology

 

For a character who had - essentially - a coat of holding, I used this construction:

 

Enfold: EDM (single dimension), Usable as Attack, Only vs Inanimate Objects

 

Holding Space: Base, Extradimensional, just a few hexes large.

Base Powers:

1) Major Transform, Objects to Folded Objects (tiny squares smaller than a stamp, held in stasis); heals by removing object from Holding Space.

2) Telekinesis, 1 STR; just to move "stamps" around.

3) EDM (anywhere), Usable as Attack, Only vs Inanimate Objects, Only to Location of Coat

4) Mind Link; to wearer of coat.

5) Clairvoyance, Transdimensional, Only via Mind Link.

6) AI to run it, with Eidetic Memory.

 

So you can store things with Enfold, tell the AI to send them back to you when needed, and your base won't get full because everything in it gets hyperfolded to minimal size. It is a fair number of powers, but the cost isn't that bad, and the utility is potentially huge.

 

I built it this way, however, because in that campaign you could buy normal equipment with money, and I was planning on using the storage ability extensively and (hopefully) to good effect. If you just want this for the cool factor, and aren't carrying around things like high explosives and motorcycles, then this construction would be overkill.