Looking for a Limitation cost

[Greywind]

I've got a character that has regeneration. Prior to 5th Ed he also had Aid for another character's BODY, only to starting level. The kicker was that he took BODY damage equal to the amount Aided. This was considered a special effect to a point as the character's Regen kicked in whenever he took a recovery.

 

Now I'm upgrading him to 5th and I need a good cost to modify his Healing to reflect that limitation. Regen is locked to the Post-Segment 12, so his Healing and damage may become more prone to combat interaction.

 

Any ideas as to the limit cost and why? I want the cost to make sense within the game. I don't want it too cheap as to make it a daily occurance and I don't want it too expensive as to prohibit the character's ability to have the power.

[bjbrown]

That sounds like a Side Effect to me. Purchase an RKA that yields an average BODY result roughly equal to, or slightly less, than the BODY on an average Healing roll (5 pts. of RKA per 1d6 of Healing), and compare that to the active points chart for the value of the limitation (a -½ limitation, unless you come up with less than a 2d6K RKA). Then you could apply the x2 limitation doubler for a Side Effect that always occurs. Add a note to the limitation that, instead of rolling the RKA, you just use the BODY of the Healing to determine the damage from the Side Effect.

I would be inclined to be a little more stingy on the limitation cost if the Healing was often used out of combat (because the damage isn't as limiting if you just regenerate it back up), but if the Healing is often used in combat, then I think the Side Effect is worth full value.

[Farkling]

RKa or BODY drain...either way it bypasses the defenses...

 

Side effects for BODY drain is the way it is applied in my writeups for empathic healing.

 

The same side effect on STUN is also built as a Drain...which, if you consider, is a sharper tooth...considering there is an actual DELAY on the points returning (ie, Regeneration does NOT restore lost power points...now we are in a fuzzy area though...is a Drain to one of these stats a PP loss? Or damage?)

[Dust Raven]

I would just call it a -1 Side Effect (full Active Points). It's just the reverse of Healing anyways.

 

Personally, I wouldn't say that the character having regeneration, or wether or not he used the power in combat would have any effect on the value of the LImitation. If he takes the damage, even if only temporaily, it will hamper him in combat. If he doesn't use it in combat, then that's limiting too. It's almost like saying Concentration 0 DCV isn't worth anything because it wouldn't be used in combat.

[Hugh Neilson]

Or that extra time is worthless for NPC's, because PC's never get there until the power's almost active or fully active anyway

[bjbrown]

On 5E pg. 202, under the description of Side Effects, there is a cautionary paragraph for allowing a Side Effects where the effects are easily erased (citing as an example "it's not much of a Limitation for a character to take BODY damage from a failed use of a power if he has Regeneration Healing").

I also wouldn't see taking damage as just the reverse of Healing. Healing permanently restores a lowered characteristic; the power that permanently lowers BODY is an RKA.

Though the Side Effect could be defined as a Drain rather than an RKA, the reason that I (if the GM in this case) would insist on the RKA rather than the Drain is that (a) if the power is an empathic-healing type power, the damage should have a permanent effect (RKA) rather than temporary (Drain), and ( because Drain potentially costs more in active points to get the same level of loss of BODY as RKA. One of the benefits of the power Drain over RKA is that Drain is applied against an exotic defense. In the context of a Side Effect, however, no defenses apply anyway. I would require the more cost-effective power to be a Side Effect. That's more of a preference, though, and and using a Drain is certainly within the rules.

[Farkling]

But you as GM can set the return rate on the drain...and Regen will not return drained BODY points...so at +1 to the allotted Drain die(dice), you get a return rate of...what? 5 points per hour?...

 

Then the Drain has a more lasting effect in spite of the Regen.

 

Of course, if the character takes the -1 level, it could be simply dictated that the damage is unaffected by Regeneration...

[prestidigitator]

Originally posted by bjbrown

I also wouldn't see taking damage as just the reverse of Healing. Healing permanently restores a lowered characteristic; the power that permanently lowers BODY is an RKA.

Actually, I believe if you Drain a Characteristic like Body, End, Stun, etc., there is no return rate; it has to be healed normally.

 

Now I have actually taken exception to this for Adjustments which are meant to reduce the maximum characteristic for a time ("permenant" wounds, etc.), but I believe this should be an Advantage, as it is not normally the way it works.

[bjbrown]

BODY, END, and STUN are Drained only temporarily, like any other stat. The Drain description doesn't specify any exception for BODY, END, and STUN. You might be thinking of the rule that when a Drain kills someone (reduces a person below negative value in BODY) or breaks something (reduces a thing to zero BODY), in that case the BODY doesn't recover; the target is dead or destroyed.