UFH: The Sixth Sun setting (Pulp Hero style)

[Steve]

After reading the Sixth Sun setting in UFH, where the return of magic took place in 1957 (and has been around until the year 2009 where the campaign takes place), I was wondering what it would be like if the change was moved back to say 1901 and then set the campaign in 1935 or so.

 

I keep having this image of Pulp-era Shadowrun when I consider that. Imagine an Elf Nazi SS officer. Would Nazi eugenic beliefs allow such a thing?

 

Or would the Nazis even exist at all? How would the First World War have been affected by magic returning in 1901? What might the 1930s be like after the world has had 30 years of adapting to the return of magic and old gods?

[Lawnmower Boy]

Re: UFH: The Sixth Sun setting (Pulp Hero style)

 

Nazi eugenicist elves? You can see Tolkien fighting that trope from page one.

[gojira]

Re: UFH: The Sixth Sun setting (Pulp Hero style)

 

It's a cool idea. Although I think it's basically steampunk+magic, which has been done. Full Metal Alchemist comes to mind. A complete, unique 1930's era magic steampunk world would be pretty interesting though.

 

You gotta define Nazi's in your game world yourself. I would keep them, they're just too darn fun to fight. Maybe have them mixed up with the Unseelie Court though, rather than just "elves", and of course other fell things.

 

Hmm, now I gotta go watch Wizards again.

[Shadowsoul]

Re: UFH: The Sixth Sun setting (Pulp Hero style)

 

I would rather expect Nazis to attempt the mass extermination of Elves and any other non-standard humanoids. If not then they would have a slightly different take on the world to incorporate different kinds of humanoids.

 

Magic in the Pulp Era would certainly make all that exploration a lot more important. Finding an old tomb in the Amazonian rainforest could be critical to the world's security if it's full to the brim with magical artefacts. Indiana Jones might be the USA's most highly paid agent!

 

Hellboy would be a good resource, a lot of his enemies are Nazis or related to them somehow.

[Steve]

Re: UFH: The Sixth Sun setting (Pulp Hero style)

 

The Thule Society would be even more prominent in Nazi Germany 35 years after magic returns, I would imagine.

 

Since the old gods would return as part of the Sixth Sun, that would mean the Norse gods would re-appear. The Nazis followed a Germanic pagan belief system, I believe. That could play into their revised background.

 

If the Sixth Sun was born in 1901, that would ignite mass catastrophes across the globe. Perhaps fascism and Nazism came about in response to that instead of the First World War as people turned to strong leaders in a time of unrest and fear. Perhaps the War never happened.

 

While Shadowrun non-humans do have a certain appeal, maybe the setting works better to just have humans with magic. (Although I have a fondness for the image of a Chinese elf woman dressed in Dragon Lady attire).

[gojira]

Re: UFH: The Sixth Sun setting (Pulp Hero style)

 

The Nazis followed a Germanic pagan belief system' date=' I believe.[/quote']

 

What?! Where do people get nonsense like this?

 

Hitler was Catholic.

[Lord Liaden]

Re: UFH: The Sixth Sun setting (Pulp Hero style)

 

I highly recommend Aaron Allston's marvelous novel, Doc Sidhe. Doc Savage meets urban fantasy!

 

Here are a bunch of informative customer reviews on Amazon.com. And from here you can download the whole novel, freely and legally.

 

Finally, check out the cover below for a taste of the flavor of the book.

[bubba smith]

Re: UFH: The Sixth Sun setting (Pulp Hero style)

 

I highly recommend Aaron Allston's marvelous novel' date=' [b']Doc Sidhe[/b]. Doc Savage meets urban fantasy!

 

Here are a bunch of informative customer reviews on Amazon.com. And from here you can download the whole novel, freely and legally.

 

Finally, check out the cover below for a taste of the flavor of the book.

doc "side? i might check this one out

[Steve Long]

Re: UFH: The Sixth Sun setting (Pulp Hero style)

 

Doc SHEE. It's an Irish word, meaning "faerie." In Irish, S before a vowel like I is pronounced like SH.

 

As for the rest of it, you can understand why I "Fantasy Anglicized" the spelling of Irish words in Tuala Morn.

[Markdoc]

Re: UFH: The Sixth Sun setting (Pulp Hero style)

 

What?! Where do people get nonsense like this?

 

Hitler was Catholic.

 

And saw himself as a proud crusader and defender of christianity, I know. However, there were a few fruitcakes in the Nazi party, especially in the early days who were interested in Occultism (it was actually not an uncommon interest in the 20's and 30's).

 

Also the Prussians frequently used early German imagery in building a national identity* and the Nazis took that over. These days, people recall the Teutonic tribe images and forget that Charlemagne, Barbarossa and the Teutonic knights were more frequently used.

 

That image of Nazi Occultists has been cemented by Indiana Jones.

 

Still, for a pulp/fantasy hybrid, I'd go with it anyway. Nazis make good villains. Nazis intent on stealing the spear of Odin and using it in a new great war, make great villains.

 

cheers, Mark

 

*An important element in Jugendstil - and one used actually all over Europe, not just in Germany.

[gojira]

Re: UFH: The Sixth Sun setting (Pulp Hero style)

 

And saw himself as a proud crusader and defender of christianity' date=' I know. However, there were a few fruitcakes in the Nazi party, especially in the early days who [b']were[/b] interested in Occultism (it was actually not an uncommon interest in the 20's and 30's).

 

 

Yes, but a few fruitcakes didn't include Hitler, or the Nazi party as a whole. I realize Hitler wasn't observant, either, but he apparently still considered himself Catholic, and was generally supported by the Catholic church hierarchy through out his career.

 

 

That image of Nazi Occultists has been cemented by Indiana Jones.

 

 

Really? The Arc of the Covenant and the Holy Grail are not Christian? Hmm, not sure I buy that. The Catholicism is removed from those movies, but I always understood them to mean that the Nazis were very interested in using Christianity to further their political and military power.

[Lucius]

Re: UFH: The Sixth Sun setting (Pulp Hero style)

 

What?! Where do people get nonsense like this?

 

Hitler was Catholic.

 

It's certainly not accurate, but it's not complete nonsense either. A great deal of what's been written about groups like the Thule Society IS nonsense, but they also did exist.

 

Really? The Arc of the Covenant and the Holy Grail are not Christian? Hmm, not sure I buy that.

 

Well, those are two different relics. The Holy Grail is Christian (although even that could be debated....) but the Ark of the Covenant most definitely is not. What made you think it was? It would predate Christianity by more centuries than I care to count right now.

 

Lucius Alexander

 

House of the Palindromedary

[gojira]

Re: UFH: The Sixth Sun setting (Pulp Hero style)

 

I think we're starting to threadjack Steve's thread here. I feel bad enough about going off topic already. Maybe NGD?

[Steve]

Re: UFH: The Sixth Sun setting (Pulp Hero style)

 

I think we're starting to threadjack Steve's thread here. I feel bad enough about going off topic already. Maybe NGD?

 

Trying to get the thread back on topic, what changes would you see if the premise of the Sixth Sun setting was moved to 1935 from 2009?

 

China might be faring a bit better against the Japanese with magic-enhanced martial artists offsetting guns.

 

Magical mind control techniques could make for an even more terrifying version of Stalin's Russia.

[gojira]

Re: UFH: The Sixth Sun setting (Pulp Hero style)

 

Trying to get the thread back on topic, what changes would you see if the premise of the Sixth Sun setting was moved to 1935 from 2009?

 

China might be faring a bit better against the Japanese with magic-enhanced martial artists offsetting guns.

 

Magical mind control techniques could make for an even more terrifying version of Stalin's Russia.

 

 

Yeah sorry about that.

 

Really, any of the big world stuff can go any way you want. If those ideas are more useful to you in your campaign, go for it. But I don't think there's any inherent way that magic must affect the real world.

 

I'd start small. What do you want your players to experience first? What are their options for characters? And what kind of world did they experience on a personal level before the campaign starts?

 

Shadowrun implies some sort of troubleshooter status for your characters. You might want to look at their immediate employers and adversaries. Unless this adventure takes place internationally, I don't think the heroes should encounter many Nazis.

 

(I'm just now remembering a Discovery Channel show in the Hindenburg, were they showed film of Americans giving German victims Nazi salutes. Nazis were respected or even admired, before WWII broke out. So even if you met a Nazi, he or she might not exactly be the thing of evil a modern person would expect. Makes the Unseelie court an even better patron of some Nazi members, as the Fae are almost always depicted as fair seeming, and capricious rather than outright evil.)

 

So yeah, what city will your players occupy, what's the geographic range of their activities, and what do you anticipate for adversaries?

 

(Getting another mental image now... of an adversary and ally both... the city itself ... run by a plugged in robotic Maria ... steampunk hacking style...Metropolis lives!)

[gojira]

Re: UFH: The Sixth Sun setting (Pulp Hero style)

 

Hmm, still thinking about this...

 

I remember (barely) something about Essence in Shadowrun. Getting cyber implants destroyed essence, making the user more vulnerable to certain types of magics. I think 6th Sun tries to model this with NND attacks, but what if we did something a little closer?

 

Essence: All players start with a default of 8 points of Essence. Essence is Power Defense, with the +1/2 modifier Essence. Power Defense bought this way counts as both regular Power Defense and Essence Defense. To buy Essence Defense only, buy Power Defense with the -1/2 modifier: Essence Defense Only.

 

Now switch most of the NND spells in 6th Sun to AVLD: Essence, and add -1: Only Affects Living Things. You'll probably have to muck around with power levels. I picked 8 points as a general "somewheres between 6 and 12 points of defense is good for low power Pulpy stuff." It should be adjusted for the power level of your campaign.

 

Then add:

 

The Metal Men: Bronze, steel, copper, iron... men and women who have been injured sometimes get replacement parts made by technology. This allows some interesting enhancements, such as greater strength, additional damage, or useful tools and abilities. However, each such modification costs Essence, making the user more susceptible to certain magics and technologies. Each modification costs one point of Essence. A character cannot drop him- or herself below 0 Essence.

 

(The actual Essence lost might need to be varied by AP of the modification, e.g. 1 point of Essence per 10 AP of the modification, rounded to the nearest 0.5 Essence. 0.5 Essence is rounded down, against the metal man but in favor of any opponent.)

[bubba smith]

Re: UFH: The Sixth Sun setting (Pulp Hero style)

 

Doc SHEE. It's an Irish word, meaning "faerie." In Irish, S before a vowel like I is pronounced like SH.

 

As for the rest of it, you can understand why I "Fantasy Anglicized" the spelling of Irish words in Tuala Morn.

thanks

[Kristopher]

Re: UFH: The Sixth Sun setting (Pulp Hero style)

 

Since the old gods would return as part of the Sixth Sun' date=' that would mean the Norse gods would re-appear. The Nazis followed a Germanic pagan belief system, I believe. That could play into their revised background. [/quote']

 

There was no overarching Nazi belief system, other than "Aryans* good, everyone else varying degrees of not-as-good to down-right-bad" and "Germany uber alles".

 

There were all sorts of mish-mashed, butchered belief systems and mythologies competing for time and power within the Nazi party.

 

 

* Well, what they considered Aryans, not the actual Aryans of actual history.

[Lord Liaden]

Re: UFH: The Sixth Sun setting (Pulp Hero style)

 

* Well' date=' what they considered Aryans, not the actual Aryans of actual history.[/quote']

 

Who were the ancestors of inhabitants of northern India and the Iranian Plateau. Wouldn't that have stuck in the craw of "that paper-hanging sonnuvab!tch" (to quote George Patton).

[gojira]

Re: UFH: The Sixth Sun setting (Pulp Hero style)

 

Still thinking about this:

 

The Jaguar Kings: Aztec Priest-Kings who rule form stepped-pyramid shaped buildings and are rumored to use blood magic, not always their own blood, either.

 

Lemuria and Atlantis: Both groups are a strong presence on both land and sea.

 

People of 10,000 Gods: I'll speculate that South East Asia is fragmented politically and religiously, clinging to their many spirits and small gods that inhabit their native lands. The Shinto religion in Japan is the single largest and most powerful magical-political group.

[bubba smith]

Re: UFH: The Sixth Sun setting (Pulp Hero style)

 

Who were the ancestors of inhabitants of northern India and the Iranian Plateau. Wouldn't that have stuck in the craw of "that paper-hanging sonnuvab!tch" (to quote George Patton).

yes it would

[gojira]

Re: UFH: The Sixth Sun setting (Pulp Hero style)

 

The Bright Boys: Various inventors, including an aged Nikola Tesla, who are responsible for many of the weird science inventions in 6th Sun, 1930. Albert Einstein is an honorary Bright Boy, although he has created no actual inventions, and has retreated from public life to become a sort of guru on the mountain top. Another Bright Boy outfit, the Wright Co., named for it's co-founders, Orville and Wilbur, is famous for it's use of Sky Hooks -- dirigibles with large cranes used to erect many of the larger buildings.

 

Walker Pilots: Artificial, steam driven machines, designed to do work in place of people, piloted by a small person who is its Pilot. The most well known pilots are the Iron Guard, ten foot tall armed metal guards who patrol the streets of Campaign City.

[Kristopher]

Re: UFH: The Sixth Sun setting (Pulp Hero style)

 

Doc SHEE. It's an Irish word, meaning "faerie." In Irish, S before a vowel like I is pronounced like SH.

 

As for the rest of it, you can understand why I "Fantasy Anglicized" the spelling of Irish words in Tuala Morn.

 

Serious question about that.

 

I have several sources that claim that "sidhe" was originally a word for mound or hill, not the people, and that the actual name would be something like "Aes Sidhe", meaning "people of the mound".

 

Did you come across anything like that in your research for Tuala Morn?

[Shadowsoul]

Re: UFH: The Sixth Sun setting (Pulp Hero style)

 

Sidhe does refer to the mound as well. But I think that Sidhe alone can refer to the creatures as well.

 

Incidentally, the sorceresses in the Wheel of Time are clearly named after these legendary beings. Aes Sidhe becomes Aes Sedai.

[SKJAM!]

Re: UFH: The Sixth Sun setting (Pulp Hero style)

 

I'd have fantasy humanoids be "lost races" who have been cut off from Terra for millenia (except perhaps a few stragglers who inspired legends), but the Sixth Sun caused the entrances to their hidden lands to become available for transit. (In fact, I'm planning to use something very much like this idea for a future campaign.) You still have to travel to remote places to reach those entrances, of course.

 

(That'd make a good self-contained adventure: A new entrance to...somewhere...has been found in the Rocky Mountains, and a small band of brave explorers must enter, find out what's in there, and with luck make an alliance that will strengthen America against the forces of the Hun.)