Speeding Up Combat

[CpSpalding]

I am sure that this question has been asked many times, but searching the forum has not worked for me so I'll start a thread and hope that I'm not going over too much old ground. I have a Golden Age campaign that is going out with a bang. There is going to be a big stateside attack of Nazi supers and my fear is that instead of a heroic struggle, the sheer number of combatants might lead to a grind. I'm looking for house rules and other suggestions for making mass combat move quicker. Any help is appreciated.

[CTaylor]

Re: Speeding Up Combat

 

There are a few ways to speed things up. Here are some tips I recommend:

 

1) When a non-critical character goes down (unconscious or falls off a train, etc), they're gone. Only the big super villains and someone critical to the story get a recovery

2) Prep tactics for your bad guys before the game. Write down what they'll try to do and how they'll react to situations, just to get it in your mind, and stick to it.

3) Give minor bad guys (thugs, agents, etc) a number of hits before they go down rather than keeping stats. THis guy takes 2 hits (or 1 really good hit), this guy takes 3, etc.

4) Keep things moving. If someone stalls working on the ultimate power pool power or can't figure out what maneuver to use, skip them - they're holding their phase til later.

5) Don't use a lot of complex bad guys. Make them very one color: this guy has a blast, this guy is strong, etc. That makes decision making for them much easier. If you create them like MMOG monsters it works well: this guy is a generic martial artist, but he has x special maneuver he can use y times a turn, max.

6) Don't have mass combats. Keep the numbers down, as few as possible to get the job done. Focus on the setting rather than the variety of villains: you can make a fight with nazis or fifth columnists interesting by varying the setting and environment even if they're identical to the last batch (this time it's on the top of a speeding train, this time it's in a burning building, this time a sinking ship, etc)

7) Get a good combat record program and run it on a laptop or PDA. There are a few downloadable ones out there, I recommend the old, old DOS-based GSPC, its old but good and easy to use. This will make combat phases much easier to keep track of.

 

Just a few hints I find useful when I run a game.

[Sean Waters]

Re: Speeding Up Combat

 

Couple of things.

 

First use standard damage for mook characters, or just average rolls. That also prevents mooks getting lucky and one-shotting a Hero at a critical moment.

 

Second, have players work out damage in advance and roll to hit and damage dice and KB simultaneously (although that can be depressing if you roll good damage but miss ). You'll need different coloured dice, of course.

 

Third, for a big combat, I'd get some index cards, label them with each character's name/designation (heroes, villains and mooks), and, top right, the phases they act on. Note the STUN/END/BODY/REC of the character on the card and lay them out in DEX order. For mook characters note their ranged and melee damages (they will always use the same attack) or better yet standardise the ranged and melee damage for each mook.

 

Use the cards to keep order: call a phase then just run a finger along the index cards to see who acts and in what order. Use the cards to record STUN/END/BODY and any adjustments. When you've marked a card, put it back where it came from and move to the next. Once you get to the end of the row, call a new phase and start over. Remove the cards for unconscious mooks immediately, and for major character if they are beyond hope of resuccitation.

[Alibear]

Re: Speeding Up Combat

 

Forget end - just throw it out of your window.

 

Little people don't fight to the death - one good lick and they're out.

 

Little people don't dodge or block or do anything complicated.

 

Don't roll unless it affects the character directly - if 15 stormtroopers attack only roll the 6 that attack the PC's the rest is just GM narrative.

 

The Heroes should shine - if someone rolls a great damage roll let him put the baddy down.

 

No Baddy's recover.

[Utech]

Re: Speeding Up Combat

 

Group your combatants and have groups act as individuals.

 

Example:

Group contains one combatant: OCV 3, DCV 3, Damage 3d6

Group contains two combatants: OCV 4, DCV 3, Damage 4d6

Group contains three combatants: OCV 5, DCV 3, Damage 5d6

Group contains four combatants: OCV 6, DCV 3, Damage 6d6 Autofire

Group contains five combatants: OCV 7, DCV 3, Damage 7d6 Autofire

Group contains six combatants: OCV 8, DCV 3, Damage 8d6 Autofire

Group contains seven combatants: OCV 9, DCV 3, Damage 9d6 Autofire + Armor Piercing

etc.

 

Most PC hits will eliminate one combatant from a group. Area Effect, Autofire, Spread, what-have-you attacks can eliminate more than one combatant at the GMs discretion.

[Doc Democracy]

Re: Speeding Up Combat

 

For big combats with LOTS of mooks I go beyond the one hit one mook - just like Utech's suggestion.

 

I set a DCV and a damage threshold. Each Hero rolls an attack. For every two the roll is made by a mook is taken out, for every 2D6 the attack is greater than the threshold a mook is taken out and then there are some bonuses for good soliloquies, working to heroic disadvantages and to Schtick.

 

That way superheroes wade through bunches of villainous mooks without too much in the way of time taken - all you need to do is keep track of how many mooks are out and when you want to begin feeding in the big guys.

 

I only made one attack against the heroes each phase - better rolls did more STUN and/or END until the right number of mooks had been dealt with and the the heroes get into the fight proper. The mooks stand aside to watch or flee the scene as appropriate - they do not interfere...

 

 

Doc

[Mr. Gridlock]

Re: Speeding Up Combat

 

I use a dice roller. The one built into Hero Designer is nice.

[prestidigitator]

Re: Speeding Up Combat

 

Forget END unless the heroes are built specifically with very tiring powers, they are Pushing, or some very strenuous situation comes up (e.g. the brick and one of the big baddies are standing toe-to-toe slugging it out Turn after Turn).

[Sean Waters]

Re: Speeding Up Combat

 

If you build your mooks right a single average hit will put them out of combat anyway. I do not know what your campaign average damage is but, assuming 10DC, that averages 35 stun. If they have 3 pd and 3 points of body armour they still take 29 stun after defences and that should stun them and probably KO them too.

 

The problem with mooks is that there are a lot of them (usually) and they often carry killing attacks - one lucky roll and you've got comatose hero, so use average damage or normal attacks.

 

Even a small team of superheroes, playing it completely straight, should take out a 15 agent types in less than a turn. 12 seconds, people. No need to jazz that up: it is awesome.

[CpSpalding]

Re: Speeding Up Combat

 

Some great ideas keep them coming. Some of these things I do already. Some I will for this special situation. I vary the combats a lot, but we have a Jewish hero who is taking the team to rescue his family from the Nazis in Europe. The game is four colors and even quite silly at times and after tackling some of the more gruesome aspects of the war, we will end the campaign (temporarily, but probably for a few years) with a big patriotic fight to protect the home front. I have a great city map to use and I really want this to feel like stopping an invasion and not a supervillain team.

[prestidigitator]

Re: Speeding Up Combat

 

Give them opportunities to use that terrain you have mapped out to take out large groups. A large building ready for the topple (to cut off paths if not crush, depending on how lethal the heroes usually are in this game). Perhaps a water tower or dam that can broken open to wash out a whole company of soldiers. Maybe even features that will suggest some more conventional tactics like dividing enemy forces, manipulating them into useless positions, etc. In other words, speed up the combat by encouraging the heroes to use creative solutions that'll reduce the amount of actual combat you engage in in the first place, while still giving them plenty to do and opportunities for satisfying effectiveness.

[Sean Waters]

Re: Speeding Up Combat

 

Remind the players about spreading attacks and the sweep maneouvre - useful for taking out several nazis at once

 

Also many superheroes can almost ignore normal fire, which makes it useful for coralling soldiers, as does bringing down buildings.

 

It can be hard to stop tanks directly but it is relatively straightforward to flip them over, which renders them useless.

[Alibear]

Re: Speeding Up Combat

 

Normal soldiers in WWII had a helmet which covered location 4 and that was it, no body armour.

 

With they're 2 or 3 PD and 8 body they'll all be toast after any attack which hits. Anyone who takes an average 10 body hit will be at zero body and bleeding to death or thereabouts instantly. Not too many people will continue fighting under such circumstances.

[mattingly]

Re: Speeding Up Combat

 

What works for me is high DCs, low DEFs.

 

Plus, as a GM, I know which of my players are slow when it comes to figuring out how much to roll, remembering their OCV, whether they have Flash Defense, etc. So I keep a chart with everyone's relevant numbers. That way, for those who need that gentle nudge, I can tell them to roll a 12 or less to hit, or whatever.

[Balabanto]

Re: Speeding Up Combat

 

Add well roleplayed soliloquies. Nothing kills combat like "God, look at the time.' If you can make your players not look at the clock, that's the key.

[GoldenAge]

Re: Speeding Up Combat

 

I've been using a dice rolling IPhone app when I GM. The speed of calculating attacks and damage has been reduced to the point where it seems instantaneous!

 

Of course I wouldn't force my players to go electric, the tactile joy of rolling dice is a key part of the game, but when I'm running 10 villains, each with a 10d6 EB it's awesome!!!

 

I highly recommend you GMs out there entertain e-dice rollers!

[RDU Neil]

Re: Speeding Up Combat

 

Group your combatants and have groups act as individuals.

 

Example:

Group contains one combatant: OCV 3, DCV 3, Damage 3d6

Group contains two combatants: OCV 4, DCV 3, Damage 4d6

Group contains three combatants: OCV 5, DCV 3, Damage 5d6

Group contains four combatants: OCV 6, DCV 3, Damage 6d6 Autofire

Group contains five combatants: OCV 7, DCV 3, Damage 7d6 Autofire

Group contains six combatants: OCV 8, DCV 3, Damage 8d6 Autofire

Group contains seven combatants: OCV 9, DCV 3, Damage 9d6 Autofire + Armor Piercing

etc.

 

Most PC hits will eliminate one combatant from a group. Area Effect, Autofire, Spread, what-have-you attacks can eliminate more than one combatant at the GMs discretion.

 

I really like this one and have used it before. I had a big gang war... two large gangs with supers on both side and the good guy and cops caught int he middle. Every five gang/cops... was one opponent with a standard CV and Damage. Damage done hurt or eliminated another group. If a group had a Super with them, the super was played as normal, but the group got bonuses to CV and damage.

 

I would also support the suggestion that all but the most important villains and heroes have stats simply "X damage if they hit... will take 1 hit, 2 hits, 3 hits before going down" done. Even minor supervillains can be played this way.

 

The important thing is that, as GM, you decide what happens based on what is dramatic. Use lots of dramatic description with ultra-simplified rolls that the players can participate in. "Ok... as you dance around with Der Fleidermaus, a squad of US Marines makes a counter attack, rushing at the Nazi frogmen Thompson's blazing!" Then have a player roll the attack "Marines have 5 OCV and the Frogmen have 6 DCV for cover and range. Roll it! The better you roll, the more damage done!" Then use one roll to resolve that salvo. "You rolled an 8! Whee! The Marines pour it on and cut most of the Frogmen to ribbons, driving the others back into cover for the moment!" or "Rolled a 14?! Damn! The Nazi's were prepared. They move forward undercover of the sea wall and now that Marine squad is exposed for the counter attack!"

 

That kind of thing makes combat really flavorful, and you can spend time with the details on the named hero fights.

[BlackSword]

Re: Speeding Up Combat

 

In games where it makes since to have opponents (or allies) group together, I typically use 'fire teams' of about 5 opponents. For each opponent past the first the group has +1 OCV, and +1 DC. This allows me to roll for five people with a single roll. Heroes and special characters operate as normal. When our group abstracts it out further to mass combat, we usually use a version of the L5R mass combat rules that we have modified.

[Thia Halmades]

Re: Speeding Up Combat

 

I think that one of the major issues in a situation like this is that the focus is on the idea that the PCs must engage every single opponent in the field, which really isn't the case. One group of heroes does not repel a Nazi assault, no matter how powerful they are, it's just "kind of silly." So I would suggest the following:

 

1) Let's assume your heroes aren't the clean up crew; this isn't house-to-house fighting, there's no need for them to engage with individual Nazis. Additionally, odds the Nazis are going to engage a Golden Ager in direct combat? Low to zero.

 

2) Assume the Nazis brought a big super/machine/equivalent which is going to rock Campaign Land to its very foundation -- unless our Heroes stop it!!

 

3) Assume that behind the heroes is the might of Campaign Land's military force, willing and able!!

 

Now. Who cares what happens between the Nazis and the military of campaign land? Me. Because I run heroic level games. But for this to work, in a classical sense, the ebb & flow of the fight between our Heroes!! and the villain also determines the ebb & flow of the ground war. In the early stages, as the machine pounds people through buildings, there are also 'key explosions, and a wave of bombers lay a beating down on the allied armor," -- no Hero should be stopping to deal with this. Break the fourth wall if you have too, but keep the focus on the Heroes being Heroic in the face of their final adversary.

 

They want to whack some Nazis? Hey, great, let 'em, but never let your focus slide into a grind over who-hit-what. If they're Nazis, make 'em mookable. A threat to a 150 heroic is nothing to a 450 super. A few left hooks later and half the battalion will be down. Make judicious (and comic-book/dramatic use) of Knockback. Use the environment; ground rips, avalanches, whatever.

 

Aim the camera at the big fight; forget the small stuff. Then, as they start beating back Big & Ugly, the ground way starts to turn in the allies' favor, and so on. If it's too easy, have a back up/2nd mode ready. There's also the classic bait & switch; "Here's your opening fight, oh, and he goes down like a punk! ... But wait? What's that on the horizon?" And the battle is joined. When the smoke clears, the heroes win, the nazis are on the run, and Campaign Land is saved yet again.

[CpSpalding]

Re: Speeding Up Combat

 

One thing I should add is that this is going to be a basic Pearl Harbor timed assault by the Nazi supers of wiping out the entire American super hero community who are all conveniently headquartered at Empire City. I really don't expect that I'll be using normal Nazis. However, that information is really useful too. My plan is a large battle over several blocks.

[ghost-angel]

Re: Speeding Up Combat

 

If you're using it:

 

Remove Knockback unless dramatically appropriate, or some other condition.

 

It removes a die roll, counting, possible extra damage rolls, and reduces the amount of Phases spent running back into the fight (especially for the PCs) or chasing down other combatants that are knocked around but not out.

[Doc Democracy]

Re: Speeding Up Combat

 

One thing I should add is that this is going to be a basic Pearl Harbor timed assault by the Nazi supers of wiping out the entire American super hero community who are all conveniently headquartered at Empire City. I really don't expect that I'll be using normal Nazis. However' date=' that information is really useful too. My plan is a large battle over several blocks.[/quote']

 

The other tactic I have used in games where I want the characters involved in a big battle scene but dont want to get dragged down in gaming bureaucracy is the individual perspective.

 

I plan the battle for each character - a sequence of set pieces that take place during the battle. Each character may be triumphant and those triumphs will have effects but the overall battle will play itself out as planned.

 

One example in my fantasy game was the siege of the castle owned by the players liege lord. I narrated what was going on and each round had some duel or battle for each character - the characters told me their objectives - I played out the sequences I had planned for each of them and it all came to the final set scene.

 

In this case I knew the attackers had overwhelming force and were going to take the castle. One character assigned himself the task of saving their liege lord from capture. One character wanted to claim their opponents standard. One character wanted to beat the opponents champion. The others simply wanted to survive.

 

Character 1 had an ongoing task of stopping the magically transported assassins that made it through the magical defences. He had the vantage points, allowing me to give the characters an ongoing summary of the action and how the battle was progressing.

 

Character 2 and Character 3 were put on the Hail Mary play where a tactical group from the castle were sent beyond the besieging forces to attack from behind and capture the standard, kill the leaders of the opposing force. These gave me a good chance to provide details of the opponents plans and why they had attacked the castle.

 

The other characters were assigned to key points in the castle's defences - allowing me to provide the players with detailed information on how much better the opponents troops were and how badly the overall battle was going.

 

Everyone survived (they almost always do). Character 1 was very successful and killed every assassin I sent ensuring that their liege lord was present in the final scene (otherwise his wife would have been giving the characters the heir to look after). Character 2 and 3 were unsuccessful though the champion was injured and unable to feature in the final scene. The other characters made some heroic stands and the final scene took place from within an intact citadel rather than from the ruins of the throne room.

 

Essentially I boiled the characters' involvement down into some more easily digestible chunks and narrated round those - amending the final scene dependent on their successes.

 

It avoids having to account for each and every mook in the battle.

 

I have also, in the past, run this sort of game by playing out the big duels while having the characters make some kind of tactics or streetwise roll to determine how much added STUN and END they are down due to the attrition of also dealing with the mooks outside the duels.

 

 

Doc

[Guest steamteck]

Re: Speeding Up Combat

 

If you're using it:

 

Remove Knockback unless dramatically appropriate, or some other condition.

 

It removes a die roll, counting, possible extra damage rolls, and reduces the amount of Phases spent running back into the fight (especially for the PCs) or chasing down other combatants that are knocked around but not out.

 

 

Bah! removes lot of the fun too.

[Utech]

Re: Speeding Up Combat

 

This is hardly speeding up combat, but it's a heck of a lot of fun for playing out a big battle.

 

Take a page (or all of them) from CoC's Innsmouth adventure. It includes a massive assault on the city by many different forces.

 

Here's how it works:

• Your heroes split up. Each joins (and perhaps commands) a group of soldiers, sailors, airmen, feds, gangsters, what-have-you.
  
• You set up three chapters of adventures for each of the different groups.
  
• When one group is running, a player gets to have his PC in the spotlight. The remaining players get the chance to run NPCs -- normals (or minor supers) with all the fun that roleplaying a new (and possibly disposable) character can bring.
  

 

Example:

The Patriot will command a group of six elite soldiers tasked with breaking into the Nazi communications bunker hidden in the basement of the propaganda ministry.

Songbird will pose as a torch song singer and join a group of French resistance fighters posing as big band members. They will be playing for key members of the Nazi command structure. At the right time, they will grab the Nazi commanders.

Piledriver will join a group of twenty marines tasked with using Nazi tactics against them. They will blitz through Nazi front lines and clear a landing ground for paratroopers to land and cut off enemy retreat.

Squidmaster will join a group of 150 sailors aboard a decrepit old ship filled with some of the UK's finest fighting men, equipment and weapons. Their bold plan is to run the ship aground in the heart of a Nazi-held city while warships draw Nazi attention elsewhere. British forces will leap out of the ship and into action -- securing the docks for more Allied forces to come.

 

Chapter 1

Patriot's forces drive (in disguise) to the Ministry of Propaganda and have to either talk, sneak, or fight their way past the front desk. How they gain entry will determine how easy things go for them in Chapter 2.

Songbird's group goes up on stage only to discover that Hitler himself is in the audience! Security is far tighter than Songbird or the Resistance had anticipated. But maybe Songbird can get close enough to... All she's got to do is sing her heart out, show a little leg, and not throw up.

Piledriver's group hits the first Nazi checkpoint. How fast can they get through? How much damage can they do without wasting time? Do the Nazi's get the word out?

Squidmaster is pleased at how well things are working out. Until the engines suddenly quit. There's a sabateur on board! Who could it be? Some questioning is in order...

 

Chapter 2

Advance each storyline. Mix up their order.

 

Chapter 3

Complete each storyline. Mix up their order. If you like, have several (or all) of the heroes join up.

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: Speeding Up Combat

 

This is hardly speeding up combat, but it's a heck of a lot of fun for playing out a big battle.

 

Take a page (or all of them) from CoC's Innsmouth adventure. It includes a massive assault on the city by many different forces.

 

Here's how it works:

• Your heroes split up. Each joins (and perhaps commands) a group of soldiers, sailors, airmen, feds, gangsters, what-have-you.
  
• You set up three chapters of adventures for each of the different groups.
  
• When one group is running, a player gets to have his PC in the spotlight. The remaining players get the chance to run NPCs -- normals (or minor supers) with all the fun that roleplaying a new (and possibly disposable) character can bring.
  

 

In addition to the advantages cited, this has a very "golden age" feel. The Heroes meet together initially, each go on their own separate adventure, then perhaps link up at the end of the story. It's not how we're used to seeing team comics work, but it's the classic Golden Age JSA and 7 Soldiers of Victory formula.