AmadanNaBriona Posted January 27, 2009 Report Share Posted January 27, 2009 Re: Double Ended Weapons Yeah' date=' but the idea of a twin-bladed weapon that one whirls around as fast as a quarterstaff and can slay a dozen attackers in the blink of an eye is quite erection inducing.[/quote'] Indeed, and I'm OK with that as long as the build reflects the fact that normal folks would freaking cut theyselves the frack apart trying to pull it off. There IS a reason, after all, that Darth Maul ended up being played by the fight choreographer... No one else they auditioned could pull off the fighting style. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prestidigitator Posted January 27, 2009 Report Share Posted January 27, 2009 Re: Double Ended Weapons I don't know. Myself, I guess I'd be more inclined to build something like that with just a +1 to Sweep if I were to go that way. Makes that second attack a little bit easier, and you'd be inclined to buy that CSL for the other +1 to be an "expert" with the weapon. I just hate built-in weapon advantages being too much of a give-away. LOL. But to each his/her own, of course. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigbywolfe Posted January 27, 2009 Report Share Posted January 27, 2009 Re: Double Ended Weapons If you do build in advantages to the two ended weapon, shouldn't you also build in the disadvantages? Most double ended weapons and even large single ended weapons (think spears) have huge limitations in close quarters, among many other issues. In a heroic level game where no one pays for weapons, I'm not sure I like the idea of Bo-staff guy gets bonuses to sweep but sword, dagger, and nun chuck guys don’t, just because they prefer different type of weapons. I think you have to find a balance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vulcan Posted January 27, 2009 Report Share Posted January 27, 2009 Re: Double Ended Weapons Yeah' date=' but the idea of a twin-bladed weapon that one whirls around as fast as a quarterstaff and can slay a dozen attackers in the blink of an eye is quite erection inducing.[/quote'] I... generally reserve mine for... well, women... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alibear Posted January 27, 2009 Report Share Posted January 27, 2009 Re: Double Ended Weapons Princess Lea in the gold bikini? I dig it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greywind Posted January 27, 2009 Report Share Posted January 27, 2009 Re: Double Ended Weapons Yeah' date=' but the idea of a twin-bladed weapon that one whirls around as fast as a quarterstaff and can slay a dozen attackers in the blink of an eye is quite erection inducing.[/quote']Yeah, but you'd have to have side-effect based on a dex roll. You miss the roll, well... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NuSoardGraphite Posted January 31, 2009 Report Share Posted January 31, 2009 Re: Double Ended Weapons If you do build in advantages to the two ended weapon' date=' shouldn't you also build in the disadvantages? Most double ended weapons and even large single ended weapons (think spears) have huge limitations in close quarters, among many other issues. In a heroic level game where no one pays for weapons, I'm not sure I like the idea of Bo-staff guy gets bonuses to sweep but sword, dagger, and nun chuck guys don’t, just because they prefer different type of weapons. I think you have to find a balance.[/quote'] Yeah, the built-in disadvantage of a double bladed weapon would be an increased critical failure range (on a 17 and 18 instead of just 18) and on a critical failure, the character does damage to their self (optionally, on a roll of 18 the character does maximum damage automatically) Bo-staff might get +2 with Sweep, but Swords get +1 OCV, Axes get +1DC, Flails get Indirect, Hammers get +1 StunX, Polearms get reach...all weapon categories have one special bonus or another. Thats what helps differentiate the various weapons from one another and makes each one useful in specific situations. And in my games, Nun-chucks DO get a Sweep Bonus. And a character with Two Weapon Combat using twin nunchucks is fracking dangerous! (thats three swings at ZERO penalty!) And I've changed the Blades class of weapons to add +1 OCV to their stats, so using the Sweep maneuver with a Sword in general is only -1 OCV for a 2-hit maneuver. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prestidigitator Posted January 31, 2009 Report Share Posted January 31, 2009 Re: Double Ended Weapons I also find it generally easier to focus more on the weapons' advantages rather than their drawbacks. Only when there's something pretty extreme am I likely to really work on building in a Side Effect or other DIsadvantage (other than the usual One-And-A-Half/Two-Handed, Real Weapon, Str Min, etc.). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sean Waters Posted February 3, 2009 Report Share Posted February 3, 2009 Re: Double Ended Weapons Hmm. Weapons that require a lot of skill to use effectively are only used effectively by people with a lot of skill. In Hero terms you build a double ended lightsabre as a weapon that damages the wielder occasionally i.e. it has, perhaps, some sort of side effect. That makes the weapon cheaper than a normal lightsabre OR more effective (when it hits) at the same price (increased OCV, or DCV or damage, perhaps). A skilled user buys a special perk (we've talked about this recently) to offset the 'side effects'. They then have a weapon that is more effective than a normal lightsabre, but only when someone who is good with it uses it: otherwise you have a weapon that is more effective than a lightsabre until you chop your own leg off. Ultimately the advantage of learning an unusual weapon is that you GENERALLY face usual weapons, so know how to fight them, but opponents GENERALLY do not face unusual weapons so you have them at a disadvantage. It is like learning to fence left handed. A double Lightsabre is going to eb an ususual weapon; you will need to spend an extra point to use it (in a heroic game). If you want to actually play this at all, how about using the 'Analyse' skill? A good roll will get you a bonus to DCV, but the roll will be at a penalty if you are trying to analyse the fighting style of someone with a weapon you are not familiar with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manic Typist Posted February 3, 2009 Report Share Posted February 3, 2009 Re: Double Ended Weapons I just got back from German longsword class, and I suspect many game designers don't really realize exactly how damn fast you can make an ordinary bastard sword do tricks. Furthermore, ANY hafted weapon has some of the same advantages, except in some cases more pronounced (such as in the case of Block maneuvers). For example... I spent years sparring with a bardiche with a 5 foot haft, a Great Axe in game terms, and by exploiting the balance difference between the blade end and the butt end I can move the butt around in a parry using the weight of the blade to provide so much inertia to the butt that I've both disarmed unaware opponents and actually bent swords with the force of the impact from the wooden haft. It's actually a lot like spinning a color-guard ensign, in fact. What the hell do you DO for a living, anyway? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AmadanNaBriona Posted February 3, 2009 Report Share Posted February 3, 2009 Re: Double Ended Weapons What the hell do you DO for a living' date=' anyway?[/quote'] Short answer: Theater Long answer: Jack of all trades freelancer who spends way too much time learning things, and (just in case you don't have personal experience with us freelance theater types) has spent 20+ years scraping income off of rocks in a wide variety of fashions. Sometimes in very grey areas. the "Fight Choreographer" section of my resume is one of the more impressive parts, however. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manic Typist Posted February 4, 2009 Report Share Posted February 4, 2009 Re: Double Ended Weapons Very grey areas tend to make for pretty good stories. I hope I get to buy you a beer or something one day... And what I would give to truly be in a game with an experienced Herophile... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prestidigitator Posted February 4, 2009 Report Share Posted February 4, 2009 Re: Double Ended Weapons Very grey areas tend to make for pretty good stories. I hope I get to buy you a beer or something one day... And what I would give to truly be in a game with an experienced Herophile... You should see if you can round up enthusiasm in some of these ol' farts for an OpenRPG game or two. It works pretty well. I played in Nolgroth's Star Hero game weekly for a while. The major hurdle might be game schedule, of course, but maybe with a well-placed poll or two.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manic Typist Posted February 4, 2009 Report Share Posted February 4, 2009 Re: Double Ended Weapons What´s openRPG? And considering that I´m currently in South America right now, it´d be pretty hard for me to get involved in a game that requires realtime synching between various people. I´d love it though. I´d even like to give Champions a try on HeroCentral, since I think Champions fights are probably one of the best ways to really learn combat rules and how to use them creatively. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sean Waters Posted February 4, 2009 Report Share Posted February 4, 2009 Re: Double Ended Weapons What´s openRPG? And considering that I´m currently in South America right now, it´d be pretty hard for me to get involved in a game that requires realtime synching between various people. I´d love it though. I´d even like to give Champions a try on HeroCentral, since I think Champions fights are probably one of the best ways to really learn combat rules and how to use them creatively. Realtime synching with North America shouldn't be too much of a problem - if you are able to get into one of Steve's Wednesday Chats at a reasonable time you'll do fine. I'm 6-8 hours ahead of you lot though, so much as I'd like to do some online rpging, you would have to start very early in the day or I'd have to drink an awful lot of coffee Of course there's probably enough Europeans to get something going over here if we could organise ourselves Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prestidigitator Posted February 4, 2009 Report Share Posted February 4, 2009 Re: Double Ended Weapons OpenRPG is one of those tabletop simulation games. Gives you integrated chat plus battle map with figures and such, sharing of character sheets and other game documents, allows easy die rolls where everyone can see the results, etc. The good things about this one in particular are that it's free, easy to extend, very portable (written currently in Python, with--last I heard--plans to switch over to Java) so it'll run on pretty much any platform, and has some built-in/pre-made support for the Hero System. If you do some searching on the Other Software forum here (I think that's what it is called), you can even find a time tracking extension built by one of us for handling the Hero Time Chart. http://sourceforge.net/projects/openrpg http://www.openrpg.com/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackberry Posted February 4, 2009 Report Share Posted February 4, 2009 Re: Double Ended Weapons I'm using Battlegrounds, and v1.3e has built in support for HERO's segment-phase-turn sequencing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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