X-plain the Rule of X?

[teh bunneh]

Pretty much what the title says... can someone explain, in simple terms for my poor dumb bunneh brain, what the Rule of X is and how to figure it?

[Hermit]

Re: X-plain the Rule of X?

 

The rule of X is that if you are a 'mutant' you are automatically kewler than the other heroes who aren't.

[teh bunneh]

Re: X-plain the Rule of X?

 

::goes stabby on Hermit::

 

Anyone else, bub?

[Certified]

Re: X-plain the Rule of X?

 

The Rule of X means that as long as you don't show a Dude full Frontal in an 80's Movie you could get an R rating, please see Porkies and Revenge of the Nerds for details.

[Chris Goodwin]

Re: X-plain the Rule of X?

 

It was a way back around the 3rd-4th edition days of determining an overall power level. There were different X values for attacks, defenses, and Other. Essentially, X was roughly the maximum allowable (Damage Class + SPD) or (DEF + DCV) value or something similar; it tried to work DC, SPD, and OCV into one value and DEF, DCV, and (maybe) Movement into another.

 

Made it whole cloth into Fuzion, AFAIK.

[Certified]

Re: X-plain the Rule of X?

 

It was a way back around the 3rd-4th edition days of determining an overall power level. There were different X values for attacks, defenses, and Other. Essentially, X was roughly the maximum allowable (Damage Class + SPD) or (DEF + DCV) value or something similar; it tried to work DC, SPD, and OCV into one value and DEF, DCV, and (maybe) Movement into another.

 

Made it whole cloth into Fuzion, AFAIK.

 

You and your real answers... pfft..

[Hermit]

Re: X-plain the Rule of X?

 

It was a way back around the 3rd-4th edition days of determining an overall power level. There were different X values for attacks, defenses, and Other. Essentially, X was roughly the maximum allowable (Damage Class + SPD) or (DEF + DCV) value or something similar; it tried to work DC, SPD, and OCV into one value and DEF, DCV, and (maybe) Movement into another.

 

Made it whole cloth into Fuzion, AFAIK.

 

Spoilsport

[Chris Goodwin]

Re: X-plain the Rule of X?

 

Oh, I forgot something.

 

"We now return you to your regularly scheduled humor posts."

 

Happy?

[Lord Liaden]

Re: X-plain the Rule of X?

 

Nowadays "Rule of X" is commonly used for any formula that attempts to create an objective measure of a HERO (particularly Champions) character's overall offensive and defensive capability, so you can keep them roughly equal and rank them compared to other characters. One such basic formula, explicitly called a "Rule of X," appears in the Champions genre book, sidebars pp. 131-33. A much more detailed calculation, the "Effectiveness Rating," is described in Digital Hero #3 (and there's a free spreadsheet for it here). Then there's an online "Combat Rating" calculator created by our errant board colleague nyakki, derived from formulas in an old Adventurers Club, which you can find here.

[Hermit]

Re: X-plain the Rule of X?

 

Happy?

 

When I'm on the right pills...

[L. Marcus]

Re: X-plain the Rule of X?

 

Oh, I forgot something.

 

"We now return you to your regularly scheduled humor posts."

 

Happy?

Yes, fairly so.

[Bloodstone]

Re: X-plain the Rule of X?

 

I find Rule of X to be a very rough guideline that tends to be pretty meaningless once actual play begins...

[braincraft]

Snikt snikt bub

 

The Rule of X is that Wolverine must be on the cover of any given issue of any given comic put out on any given month.

[Bloodstone]

Re: X-plain the Rule of X?

 

Not true!

[braincraft]

I have a collection of potato chips shaped like the Legion of Superheroes

 

I can swear I see him in the pattern of flames behind them. Or it's just the Virgon Mary, I dunno.

[Lord Liaden]

Re: X-plain the Rule of X?

 

Oh, no! The Virgons are invading!

[gojira]

Re: X-plain the Rule of X?

 

So, does anyone have one or more Rules of X that they use and would like to share?

 

I'm toying around with 2*SPD + DC'S = 20.

 

Sure some folks don't like Rule of X but it does kind of help set campaign guidelines, I think.

[Lord Liaden]

Re: X-plain the Rule of X?

 

Here's a thread that presents several variants, although the discussion later bogs down over details of the Effectiveness Rating: http://www.herogames.com/forums/showthread.php?t=469

[Trebuchet]

Re: X-plain the Rule of X?

 

So, does anyone have one or more Rules of X that they use and would like to share?

 

I'm toying around with 2*SPD + DC'S = 20.

 

Sure some folks don't like Rule of X but it does kind of help set campaign guidelines, I think.

You must be looking at running a lower power campaign. We use SPD + DC <= 20 and it seems to work pretty well for a mainstream "Silver Age" Champions campaign. It's only a guideline; but no one has exceeded the number even after 15 years.

[gojira]

Re: X-plain the Rule of X?

 

You must be looking at running a lower power campaign. We use SPD + DC <= 20 and it seems to work pretty well for a mainstream "Silver Age" Champions campaign. It's only a guideline; but no one has exceeded the number even after 15 years.

 

I use SPD * 2 because I want about + 2 DC for each drop in speed.

 

So at 4 SPD, I get 12 DCs, about a 60 points attack. This is an attack for the slow brick. I don't count Haymaker, btw, but I do count all other sources of DCs. If you are counting Haymaker, then at SPD 4 we are actually the same.

 

(I just find the -4 DCs to everything to account for Haymaker to be annoying, so I just look at the DCs on the character, and lower the allowed DCs by 4.)

 

Next at 5 SPD, there's 10 DCs, about a 50 point attack.

 

Then at 6 SDP a character can have 8 DCs, about a 40 point attack. At this level I expect the character to be using Find Weakness and other similar enhancements.

 

I could see moving those up a tad. 2*SPD + DCs = 22 bumps all those DCs up by 2, so the Brick gets 14 DCs before haymaker, and the speedy guy can take up to 10 DCs with his attacks (which likely are boosted by FW or NND or similar means). But as you say it depends on the campaign levels and tone.

[Trebuchet]

Re: X-plain the Rule of X?

 

I use SPD * 2 because I want about + 2 DC for each drop in speed.

 

So at 4 SPD, I get 12 DCs, about a 60 points attack. This is an attack for the slow brick. I don't count Haymaker, btw, but I do count all other sources of DCs. If you are counting Haymaker, then at SPD 4 we are actually the same.

 

(I just find the -4 DCs to everything to account for Haymaker to be annoying, so I just look at the DCs on the character, and lower the allowed DCs by 4.)

 

Next at 5 SPD, there's 10 DCs, about a 50 point attack.

 

Then at 6 SDP a character can have 8 DCs, about a 40 point attack. At this level I expect the character to be using Find Weakness and other similar enhancements.

 

I could see moving those up a tad. 2*SPD + DCs = 22 bumps all those DCs up by 2, so the Brick gets 14 DCs before haymaker, and the speedy guy can take up to 10 DCs with his attacks (which likely are boosted by FW or NND or similar means). But as you say it depends on the campaign levels and tone.

Our brick is SPD 4 and does 15d6 not including Haymaker. Our quasi-speester/MA is SPD 9 and does 10d6 with a Sacrifice Strike. Everyone else falls somewhere in the middle of those extremes.

 

We've been kicking around the idea of increasing the number to 22 or 24, but since nobody has hit the 20 yet there hasn't been any pressing reason to change it (and it's only a guideline anyway).

[BNakagawa]

Re: X-plain the Rule of X?

 

My favorite rule of X is to calculate how many seconds it would take this PC to take out an average combatant.

 

You can just roll dice or you can do math.

 

On the flip side, you can calculate how many seconds your PC will survive against an average combatant, too.

[gojira]

Re: X-plain the Rule of X?

 

Our brick is SPD 4 and does 15d6 not including Haymaker.

 

Yup, that's a pretty high powered game there. Just curious: what do you throw at these characters for enemies? Wouldn't they just chew through regular villains like Green Dragon and Pulsar?

 

(P.S. Also, how many character points? They feel like they might be up in the 450 range or a bit higher...)

[OzMike]

Re: X-plain the Rule of X?

 

A rule of X I've used before for a high powered game was:

 

OCV + DCs + Active Defense/5 + Non-dodging DCV + 2*SPD = 60

 

What that means is a 30 DEX character with 6 SPD and no levels could have about 12D6 attacks and 30 PD/ED with 20 rPD/ED.

 

If you wanted to lower the 60 to say 50 then you could have a 23 DEX character with 5 SPD and 2 offensive levels and about 12D6 attacks and 20 PD/ED with 10 rPD/rED.

 

This rule of X worked really well to balance the characters, although one guy did go for a 3 SPD, 15 DEX, 100 STR Brick with no levels (or tricks even) but it was all in good fun. Gave me someone to pound on.

[Doc Democracy]

Re: X-plain the Rule of X?

 

The best thing about Rule of X is that it is more flexible than fixed AP caps and yet still provides some way of limiting the power level of the characters relative to each other.

 

The problem with rule of X is what to include. Too many things and it gets really complicated, too few and you have to impose other forms of capping as well.

 

If you have a stable group then a Rule of X normally comes to the fore naturally that doesn't have to be written down explicitly.

 

 

Doc