Are Heroic Characteristics Realistic?

[Markdoc]

Re: Are Heroic Characteristics Realistic?

 

While I mostly agree with this' date=' I'll add that in some campaigns it's in genre to let one player character be one of The World's Strongest Men. Look at Steve Perry's Matador series: the PCs would have been The World's Strongest Man, The World's Best Markswoman, the World's Toughest Fighter, the World's Most Beautiful Woman, and the Best of the Matadoras. NPC leader "Pen" was an old GM PC. The main problem comes up (as you suggest in your last line) when every player wants his character to be the World's Strongest Man, just because it's such an efficient build in Hero.[/quote']

 

Yeah. We've already had that discussion recently, and I don't feel like returning to it until its regularly scheduled 6 monthly reappearance.

 

But in my current (FH) game I have:

One of the world's strongest men (23 STR in a game with NCM and STR at 2:1 cost). He's also a very effective merchant!

One of the world's best public speakers (23 PRE and lots of social skills, despite NCM). He's also a pretty good - if highly specialized - fighter.

One of the world's sneakiest men (his Stealth roll hit 18- last game!). He's also a pretty good fighter, though he'd rather stick a dagger in your back than a sword in your front, if you know what I mean.

and then 3 characters who are good at a variety of things but not exceptional at any one thing. What I love about this game, though, is that all of them fit pretty well together and no-one is consistently overshadowed.

 

Of course' date=' there's also nothing wrong with a campaign built around The Middle Aged Guys at the Pub, if that's what floats your boat. (Strong as a guy who works at the book warehouse! Fast as the guy who ran track in school, but is now 40 pounds overweight and just runs on weekends! Smart as the guy who's working on his graduate degree!)[/quote']

 

This is repworthy!

 

cheers, Mark

[Lucius]

Re: Are Heroic Characteristics Realistic?

 

Just to gauge what people think is or isn't realistic:

 

Would you allow your realistically strong powerlifters, bodybuilders or heavyweight athletes to lift and move mid-size cars? Not over their heads, but just a few inches off the ground, enough to manhandle them from place to place?

 

This certainly is something well within the strength of strong humans. Arnie's exploits with Frank Columbu when they were young, walking home after going out drinking, of taking rows of parked cars on the streets and placing them end-to-end so the drivers couldn't get them out are well-documented, and not out of the ordinary for strongman pranks.

 

Is this realistic, or heroic?

 

That's not heroic. It's not even properly villainous. It's just petty. It's a couple of jerks making other peoples' lives harder just because they can. It's the kind of bullying that gives "jocks" a bad name.

 

Lucius Alexander

 

The palindromedary things good names are anna, bob, otto, eve.....

[Chris Goodwin]

Re: Are Heroic Characteristics Realistic?

 

Just to gauge what people think is or isn't realistic:

 

Would you allow your realistically strong powerlifters, bodybuilders or heavyweight athletes to lift and move mid-size cars? Not over their heads, but just a few inches off the ground, enough to manhandle them from place to place?

 

This certainly is something well within the strength of strong humans. Arnie's exploits with Frank Columbu when they were young, walking home after going out drinking, of taking rows of parked cars on the streets and placing them end-to-end so the drivers couldn't get them out are well-documented, and not out of the ordinary for strongman pranks.

 

Is this realistic, or heroic?

 

That's not heroic. It's not even properly villainous. It's just petty. It's a couple of jerks making other peoples' lives harder just because they can. It's the kind of bullying that gives "jocks" a bad name.

 

I think he meant heroic as in heroic level, not heroic as in fighting crime, defending the downtrodden.

[Comic]

Re: Are Heroic Characteristics Realistic?

 

To be fair, they did prevent a lot of drunk driving, since the cars they did this to were parked outside bars.

 

Oh, and to clarify, they didn't cooperate to each grab an end and move the cars.

 

They raced, one down either side of the street, to see who could finish first.

[AmadanNaBriona]

Re: Are Heroic Characteristics Realistic?

 

I remember hanging out at Dundracon WAY back in the dawn of time with some of the SCAdians who were doing demo's there. One of the fighters who had dated my G/F of the time (He later went on to become King of the West multiple times) decided (after a few shots) to show off by sliding under her van, grabbing the axle, and bench pressing it ten times.

 

Rather arrogant guy, even back then, but yeah...he was damn strong.

[Tonio]

Re: Are Heroic Characteristics Realistic?

 

Hero can be used to run Pub Hero or Software Developer Hero' date=' but the vast majority of gamers are going to use it to run some flavor of Heroic Fiction.[/quote']

 

Horror HERO is out?

[Lucius]

Re: Are Heroic Characteristics Realistic?

 

To be fair, they did prevent a lot of drunk driving, since the cars they did this to were parked outside bars.

 

Oh, and to clarify, they didn't cooperate to each grab an end and move the cars.

 

They raced, one down either side of the street, to see who could finish first.

 

 

Hm...in THAT case, I retract my opinion. I'm still not sure it's heroic, but it's not quite as reprehensible.

 

Lucius Alexander

 

The palindromedary notes that what Lucius doesn't want to admit is that, reprehensible or not, it's funny. Especially done to drunks. It's also impressive.

[Akiva]

Re: Are Heroic Characteristics Realistic?

 

In retrospect, I should've just let the guy have the build and dealt with it. It's not going to be quite so easy to fully explore the game if I start putting limitations out on it from the very start.

 

On the other hand, that character is now far more well-rounded and interesting; I believe that, in the long run, that player is going to have a better time. Even as we tweaked the build and ditched the 20 STR and 20 DEX, he began to see himself that he had accidentally built a one-dimensional character out of fear that the game would punish him for not being as maxed out as possible.

 

As I wrote before, it's all a matter of perspective. One of my favorite sayings about game design is 'Let the game be a game' which I suppose I can now extrapolate to 'Let the hero be a hero'.

[OddHat]

Re: Are Heroic Characteristics Realistic?

 

Just watched a strongman competition. In one event, the entire field had to carry 900 pounds (on their backs) over a 30 meter course for time. The winner completed it in 16.6 seconds.

 

Saying "No, you can't have STR above X or Dex above Y in this campaign, or a combination of DCs, Phases and CV above Z" is absolutely part of the GMs job, and whatever levels the GM sets are "right"; He's the GM. I just wouldn't bother using "is it realistic" as one of my primary criteria in most campaigns.

[ghost-angel]

Re: Are Heroic Characteristics Realistic?

 

In retrospect, I should've just let the guy have the build and dealt with it. It's not going to be quite so easy to fully explore the game if I start putting limitations out on it from the very start.

 

On the other hand, that character is now far more well-rounded and interesting; I believe that, in the long run, that player is going to have a better time. Even as we tweaked the build and ditched the 20 STR and 20 DEX, he began to see himself that he had accidentally built a one-dimensional character out of fear that the game would punish him for not being as maxed out as possible.

 

As I wrote before, it's all a matter of perspective. One of my favorite sayings about game design is 'Let the game be a game' which I suppose I can now extrapolate to 'Let the hero be a hero'.

 

Sometimes the best way to learn the system is to make a bunch of mistakes. And break stuff.