BIG Combat?

[Alibear]

I've never ran a combat between giant opponents before and I plan on running one on Thursday.

 

Now, my question is how do you deal with the DCV penalties for being BIG?

 

The combat is gonna be between a bloke in a MECH and a giant Ape with Drunken Monkey Style Kung Fu and I picture both as being basically quick and nimble, not having limited DCV, at least full DCV against each other. Do the Giant rules make allowances for that?

 

The other thing is that I thought they be basically immune to small arms fire from non giant weapons.

 

Is there anything else I should think about?

 

[Kdansky]

Re: BIG Combat?

 

If all opponents are the same size: ignore the size DCV/OCV rules. If they are different, apply. Human shoots at giant: easy target. Giant tries to hit human: rather difficult. Except for the fact that he can just AoE his HA/STR for many hexes of *splat*.

 

Invulnerability: Armor lots/lots, doubly hardened. NND might be tricky, but you can circumvent that with just giving them ridiculous stun + rec. They just shrug 5d6 hits off with 500 stun and 50 rec Are points an issue? If you only stage it, no need to put it in numbers anyway.

[ghost-angel]

Re: BIG Combat?

 

Size Modifiers for Combat: 5ER p382

[Sean Waters]

Re: BIG Combat?

 

Yep: equal sized opponents can basically ignore mutual DCV penalties: they fight at their scale. All the midgets can hit them easily (when not dodging huge falling saki bottles). If this is a one off rather thana campaign staple, I wouldn't even bother modelling their 'macro-invulnerability' - I'd just say there it is, off you go.

 

If it IS a campaign regular feature, the points are going to mount up very quickly for invulnerable defences - 3/4 DR and 50/50 armour limitied to only work against midgets (unless they EDM to the Giant Robot Monkey Zone where different rules apply - natch!)

[aylwin13]

Re: BIG Combat?

 

I have a related question (as an aside; I'm not trying to hijack the thread). I have a character with 60 pts of Growth. I've always hated the DCV penalty for Growth and I don't enjoy playing "broad side of barn" for every other character. I bought +6 to DCV (5pt CSLs), only to increase DCV to starting level. What is everyone's opinion on this? Is this a problem for you GMs out there?

[Sean Waters]

Re: BIG Combat?

 

I have a related question (as an aside; I'm not trying to hijack the thread). I have a character with 60 pts of Growth. I've always hated the DCV penalty for Growth and I don't enjoy playing "broad side of barn" for every other character. I bought +6 to DCV (5pt CSLs)' date=' only to increase DCV to starting level. What is everyone's opinion on this? Is this a problem for you GMs out there?[/quote']

 

I see no problem with it (although it is going to be interesting when it comes to stuff like combat modifiers. Hmmm have to think about that.)

 

Alternatively just buy strength or density increase with the sfx that you are huge. You might well even get a limitation value out of it. Buy stretching for extra reach and you are golden: you look huge but you are no easier to hit than if you weren't.

 

Probably.

[Lord Liaden]

Re: BIG Combat?

 

The other thing is that I thought they be basically immune to small arms fire from non giant weapons.

 

If you're using HERO stats for real-world weapons, all the published examples are built with the Limitation, Real Weapon. Part of the description of that Lim is that such weapons can't harm targets that they realistically couldn't, regardless of what's rolled on the dice. You're well within your rights to simply declare that small arms don't hurt them, or establish a Damage cutoff level below which Real Weapons aren't effective.

 

Is there anything else I should think about?

 

If the combatants are of a size such that they occupy more than one hex (as per the Growth Chart under the rulebook description for the Growth Power), I would recommend that any Area Of Effect: One Hex attacks they may possess, not be treated as AOE when used against each other.

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: BIG Combat?

 

I have a related question (as an aside; I'm not trying to hijack the thread). I have a character with 60 pts of Growth. I've always hated the DCV penalty for Growth and I don't enjoy playing "broad side of barn" for every other character. I bought +6 to DCV (5pt CSLs)' date=' only to increase DCV to starting level. What is everyone's opinion on this? Is this a problem for you GMs out there?[/quote']

 

Sean mentioned maneuver penalties. What about +6 levels to DCV Linked to Growth, so it only offsets growth penalties?

[aylwin13]

Re: BIG Combat?

 

Sean mentioned maneuver penalties. What about +6 levels to DCV Linked to Growth' date=' so it only offsets growth penalties?[/quote']

That's what these are, although I didn't think about Linked. Right now they are limited only in that they can't raise his DCV above the starting value. My real question, I think, is actually: Do you folks think that this is cheesy? Should a 60' giant be able to retain his DCV of 6, instead of being at 0?

[Alibear]

Re: BIG Combat?

 

Nah, go for it. His DCV of 6 represents his ability to shrug off many blows thus avoiding serious injury rather than the ability to actively avoid being hit. All in the sfx.

[ghost-angel]

Re: BIG Combat?

 

That's what these are' date=' although I didn't think about Linked. Right now they are limited only in that they can't raise his DCV above the starting value. My real question, I think, is actually: Do you folks think that this is cheesy? Should a 60' giant be able to retain his DCV of 6, instead of being at 0?[/quote']

 

Nope, I think it's fine.

[pinecone]

Re: BIG Combat?

 

sounds good to me...I'd not let Giants shrug damage for "free" exept as a one time thing. I do though often build with Damage reduction tied to growth....DR x1/2 PDr Lim: 4 or more levels of growth ( or what ever you like)

[Thia Halmades]

Re: BIG Combat?

 

I'm sleeping, y'all just can't tell. Two things and I don't know if they were mentioned.

 

For each step beyond the first on the size chart, increase or decrease the damage accordingly. So if it a Giant's Club is Freakin' Huge, and that's 5 steps over Normal, add 4 DCs to it. Conversely, reduce 'normal' sized weapons by 4 DCs, so a normal Greatsword goes from 2d6 to 1/2d6. They won't feel a thing. Meanwhile their clubs will deal an extra 1d6+1, and you could also arguably increase their STUNx as you like.

 

And DCV follows the same rule; it's going to be dirt easy to him 'em. You just won't hurt 'em much.

[CrosshairCollie]

Re: BIG Combat?

 

I have a related question (as an aside; I'm not trying to hijack the thread). I have a character with 60 pts of Growth. I've always hated the DCV penalty for Growth and I don't enjoy playing "broad side of barn" for every other character. I bought +6 to DCV (5pt CSLs)' date=' only to increase DCV to starting level. What is everyone's opinion on this? Is this a problem for you GMs out there?[/quote']

 

I'd be interested in hearing how you justify it, but strictly as a mechanical construct, no. Were it me, I'd just use those extra 30 points on boosting my defenses so I rarely cared if I got hit.

[aylwin13]

Re: BIG Combat?

 

Actually CC, the more I've been thinking about it, you may be right. Just because the rules will let me do it doesn't necessarily mean that I should. Yes it's pretty hard not to hit the side of a 32m tall building, I just don't like my characters getting hit. I did look into Damage Reduction 25% for PD & ED Linked to his Growth. This is probably the way to go. As he gains XP I can raise that to 50 or 75% and just not worry about the damage.

[CrosshairCollie]

Re: BIG Combat?

 

Actually CC' date=' the more I've been thinking about it, you may be right. Just because the rules will let me do it doesn't necessarily mean that I should. Yes it's pretty hard not to hit the side of a 32m tall building, I just don't like my characters getting hit. I did look into Damage Reduction 25% for PD & ED Linked to his Growth. This is probably the way to go. As he gains XP I can raise that to 50 or 75% and just not worry about the damage.[/quote']

 

I know what you mean. It's just that much cooler to avoid an attack than weather it.

[aylwin13]

Re: BIG Combat?

 

I know what you mean. It's just that much cooler to avoid an attack than weather it.

Although there is that look on the other players' faces when the Stinger rocket hits you square in the chest, the dust and smoke clears, and you're standing there glaring at the nimrod who shot it at you.

[pinecone]

Re: BIG Combat?

 

Although there is that look on the other players' faces when the Stinger rocket hits you square in the chest' date=' the dust and smoke clears, and you're standing there glaring at the nimrod who shot it at you. [/quote']

 

(Looks at point of impact, looks at dude that hit you) "are you sure you did that right?" "Maybe you should try again" (Pres attack)

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: BIG Combat?

 

A lot of large comic characters seem to avoid getting hit much more often than standard Hero penalties would indicate. How can anything that big move that fast offsetting some or all of the Growth DCV penalties seems a reasonable Supers power.

 

Really, guys, if we can get by the cube/square law not crushing a 60' human under his own mass, why not also accept the possibility he might be able to evade incoming attacks?

[Kdansky]

Re: BIG Combat?

 

Defenses defined as "If I cannot avoid the hit, I can at least roll with the punch."

DCV defined as "I am immune to damage on half my body. I don't even feel these hits."

[aylwin13]

Re: BIG Combat?

 

A lot of large comic characters seem to avoid getting hit much more often than standard Hero penalties would indicate. How can anything that big move that fast offsetting some or all of the Growth DCV penalties seems a reasonable Supers power.

 

Really, guys, if we can get by the cube/square law not crushing a 60' human under his own mass, why not also accept the possibility he might be able to evade incoming attacks?

 

Defenses defined as "If I cannot avoid the hit, I can at least roll with the punch."

DCV defined as "I am immune to damage on half my body. I don't even feel these hits."

 

This is what I was thinking when I originally wrote up the character. Now I'm not sure which way to go. Decisions, decisions.

[ghost-angel]

Re: BIG Combat?

 

SFX are SFX...

 

soaking the damage can easily be described as "Dodged at the last second"