Tauman.EXE Posted December 14, 2006 Report Share Posted December 14, 2006 Re: What does "Overall" not cover? (offtopic) CrosshairCollie wrote: Weird, I was pretty sure you could ... 3 point levels with Dive For Cover, Dodge and Block makes for an annoying target. Wouldn't that be quite pointless? I was in the impression that you only gain the DCV bonus against attacks that was covered by the skill level? (eg. HTH applied to DCV don't help you against ranged attacks) Won't that make the dodge useless. (yay, +3 DCV vs block and dive cover) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TheUnknown Posted December 14, 2006 Report Share Posted December 14, 2006 Re: What does "Overall" not cover? I'm inclined to agree with you. Find Weakness is a power' date=' not a skill, and the cost is deliberately kept relatively high for game balance purposes.[/quote'] Right I would Agree it is a power not a skill and thus you would draw the line there as A GM if it would cause problems in your game but unfortunely the rules let them apply to everything except Fam. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TheUnknown Posted December 14, 2006 Report Share Posted December 14, 2006 Re: What does "Overall" not cover? Uh...Why not? Unless theres a FAQ bit somewhere I haven't bothered reading, I don't see why any Level that adds to your Dex roll couldn't be used for the Dive for Cover. That eliminates most CSL's, but Overall levels are still good. Wll even if you couldn't directly add them to dive for covers it's a manuever that requires a dex roll so add them there wala its done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hyper-Man Posted December 14, 2006 Report Share Posted December 14, 2006 Re: What does "Overall" not cover? (offtopic) Wouldn't that be quite pointless? I was in the impression that you only gain the DCV bonus against attacks that was covered by the skill level? (eg. HTH applied to DCV don't help you against ranged attacks) Won't that make the dodge useless. (yay, +3 DCV vs block and dive cover) Nope, The only real problem with CHC's approach is that it is mixing a CSL with a SL. according to 5ER a 3 point CSL can be used, among other things, to increase OCV or DCV with 3 specific manuevers. Increasing your OCV while performing a Block will of course have no affect on ranged attacks. Increasing your DCV while performing a Dodge WILL affect ranged attacks since Dodge does this by default. However, Dive for Cover does not increase DCV. It is like a 'defensive fastdraw' to move into a different hex before the attack hits the hex the character 'was' in. CSL's have no effect on the actual success of Dive for Cover because the resolution mechanic is a DEX roll with movement (only SL's with DEX or movement can increase this). CSL's can certainly be used to increase a character's otherwise 1/2 DCV while Diving for Cover as a hedge bet. No different than using a CSL's to increase DCV while Blocking, which is a hedge of sorts since the Block will stop a specific HTH attack when successful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CorPse Posted December 14, 2006 Report Share Posted December 14, 2006 Re: What does "Overall" not cover? CSL's have no effect on the actual success of Dive for Cover because the resolution mechanic is a DEX roll with movement (only SL's with DEX or movement can increase this). CSL's can certainly be used to increase a character's otherwise 1/2 DCV while Diving for Cover as a hedge bet. No different than using a CSL's to increase DCV while Blocking' date=' which is a hedge of sorts since the Block will stop a specific HTH attack when successful.[/quote'] I agree with the majority of this. However, I am curious how a SL w/ movement could effect a DEX Roll? Only things that up the DEX Roll may be used with Dive For Cover. And as far as I can tell that's only two things: 1. SL that increase your DEX Rool, or 2. Overall Levels. But, hey, I've been wrong before... even in this Thread... so I await correction. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hyper-Man Posted December 14, 2006 Report Share Posted December 14, 2006 Re: What does "Overall" not cover? I agree with the majority of this. However, I am curious how a SL w/ movement could effect a DEX Roll? Only things that up the DEX Roll may be used with Dive For Cover. And as far as I can tell that's only two things: 1. SL that increase your DEX Rool, or 2. Overall Levels. But, hey, I've been wrong before... even in this Thread... so I await correction. see this post: http://www.herogames.com/forums/showpost.php?p=674601&postcount=31 Movement Skill Levels are already applicable to DFC per 5ER, page 369. Here are all of their possible uses: Lower Turn Mode by 1 (minimum of 0"). Add +1 to any roll (like a DEX roll for DFC) required to land in, or otherwise move to, a particular hex. (at GM's option) Increase acceleration or deceleration with his modes of movement (not vehicles) by 1" per hex per Skill Level applied. (at GM's option) Improve DCV if Dodging or using a Combat or Martial Maneuver that provides bonuses to DCV while moving. Skill Levels with one mode of mevement cost 2 Character points per Level. Skill Levels that apply to any of a character's modes of movement cost 3 Character Points per Level. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CorPse Posted December 14, 2006 Report Share Posted December 14, 2006 Re: What does "Overall" not cover? see this post: http://www.herogames.com/forums/showpost.php?p=674601&postcount=31 Cool... very cool... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sean Waters Posted December 15, 2006 Report Share Posted December 15, 2006 Re: What does "Overall" not cover? the jumpsuits they're ALMOST wearing in the Girls of NASCAR Calender are coveralls. The button top sleeveless denim things falling off the girls in the 4H Hayseed Hotties calendar are overalls. That clear things up? Quite the opposite: now something is going to need clearing up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveZilla Posted December 15, 2006 Report Share Posted December 15, 2006 Re: What does "Overall" not cover? Just in case some don't know this: Any effect that halves DCV is applied *last* in the calculation. This means that it takes *two* skill levels applied to DCV in some way to effect a 1 pt increase. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alibear Posted December 15, 2006 Report Share Posted December 15, 2006 Re: What does "Overall" not cover? That's "Coveralls". Overalls leave the arms & shoulders exposed, as well as the upper chest. Kinda like an evening gown, but more "HeeHaw"... Point of order! Sean was speaking English, you are speaking Americanish. In Scotland we say Boiler suit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hyper-Man Posted December 15, 2006 Report Share Posted December 15, 2006 Re: What does "Overall" not cover? Just in case some don't know this: Any effect that halves DCV is applied *last* in the calculation. This means that it takes *two* skill levels applied to DCV in some way to effect a 1 pt increase. except when rounding is factored in. example: DEX 23 normal DCV 8 add 1 Overall Level to DCV and you get a half DCV of 5. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NuSoardGraphite Posted December 16, 2006 Report Share Posted December 16, 2006 Re: What does "Overall" not cover? I am not as sure that they can work for Movement Levels' date=' to do things like reducing turn mode. I am guessing that they can, but I can't find anything definitive one way or the other.[/quote'] I would say yes. I've used them in that way before. I would say that "Overall Skill Levels" can be used in any way that any other type of Skill Level can be used. In addition, Overall Skill Levels can be used for any applicable roll as ruled by the GM. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveZilla Posted December 17, 2006 Report Share Posted December 17, 2006 Re: What does "Overall" not cover? I would say yes. I've used them in that way before. I would say that "Overall Skill Levels" can be used in any way that any other type of Skill Level can be used. In addition' date=' Overall Skill Levels can be used for any applicable roll as ruled by the GM.[/quote'] Could an Overall Skill Level be used as a Penalty Skill Level, or is this a moot question? It might be easier to list what an Overall Level can't do, since it can do so much even before touching "GM's option" uses. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NuSoardGraphite Posted December 17, 2006 Report Share Posted December 17, 2006 Re: What does "Overall" not cover? Could an Overall Skill Level be used as a Penalty Skill Level, or is this a moot question? It might be easier to list what an Overall Level can't do, since it can do so much even before touching "GM's option" uses. Yeah, thats kinda a moot point, since a Penalty Skill Level is simply a very limited Combat Skill Level. Any Combat Skill Level could be used in the same manner as a PSL. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghost-angel Posted December 17, 2006 Report Share Posted December 17, 2006 Re: What does "Overall" not cover? Could an Overall Skill Level be used as a Penalty Skill Level, or is this a moot question? It might be easier to list what an Overall Level can't do, since it can do so much even before touching "GM's option" uses. Sure. Take PSL: vs Range. and Overall SL. Both can add +1 to OCV, the PSL can only add it to counter Range Modifiers, the OSL applies in all situations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveZilla Posted December 17, 2006 Report Share Posted December 17, 2006 Re: What does "Overall" not cover? Yeah' date=' thats kinda a moot point, since a Penalty Skill Level is simply a very limited Combat Skill Level. Any Combat Skill Level could be used in the same manner as a PSL.[/quote'] That's pretty much what I thought. I haven't used PSLs before, and I just didn't feel like digging out my 5RE to double check myself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pinecone Posted December 24, 2006 Report Share Posted December 24, 2006 Re: What does "Overall" not cover? Kind of like Kung Fu Elvis God I love Kung fu Elvis....a ninja who can sing are you lonesome tonight while suprise attacking you.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveZilla Posted December 25, 2006 Report Share Posted December 25, 2006 Re: What does "Overall" not cover? God I love Kung fu Elvis....a ninja who can sing are you lonesome tonight while suprise attacking you.... Or sings 'Jailhouse Rock' while using Jailhouse Rock. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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