Drains of Doom? Check out these spells

[JLXC]

OK a player wants to make a Priest of a Travel and Luck God... I use a MP system for spellcasting. Anyhow I thought up these spells but thought they may be too bent in a Fantasy Hero game. Since you all have more Experience than I do what do you think of these spells? They are running from a 50 pt. Multipower

 

1) Drain 2d6 of Running, AOE Radius (Double Radius 4" total), 16 charges, Active points 45

 

2) Drain 5d6 of Dexterity, Standard effect for 15pts, 16 charges, Active pts 50

 

3) Combat Luck x 2 (6,6) plus Mental Defense 5 plus Power Defense 8, Hard to Dispel double (so x4 active points), 2 Continuing Charges of 1 day each, Active points 50

 

I will name them later before I give them to the player, essentially they know nothing of Hero and I am making their characters for them. Any input would be appreciated. My main concern is that Running is easy to mess up for many creatures, since many humanoids only have 12 points worth, and removing 5 Dex per pop with the second spell is pretty damn good. I dunno is they are overboard or not. Number 3 is essentially an alternate to FF with some lucky extras, but may be too butch I dunno.

[Markdoc]

Re: Drains of Doom? Check out these spells

 

These are fairly nasty spells, but not out of line. Sure, whacking 5 DEX off someone is nasty - but so is hitting them with a 3d6+1 lightning bolt...

 

cheers, Mark

[JLXC]

Re: Drains of Doom? Check out these spells

 

These are fairly nasty spells, but not out of line. Sure, whacking 5 DEX off someone is nasty - but so is hitting them with a 3d6+1 lightning bolt...

 

cheers, Mark

 

Well that puts things in perspective heh. Thanks!

 

[Ndreare]

Re: Drains of Doom? Check out these spells

 

Spell three I would "Veto" instead making him construct the spell as a Force Field (invisable if he wants). I have found that persistant powers in frameworks get very abused.

 

The other two spells seem very in line with magic of Luck and I would allow them as long as he stayed consistant. I mean after all like he said a 5 dex drain is farley close in effectiveness to a 10D6 Energy Blast or a 3D6+1 Killing Attack.

 

Yes these spells are powerful but if you balance the chalenges with the power of the spells and other characters.

 

 

Are you allowing the fighter to have 50 AP attacks or only mages can be powerful? That is were it realy boils down.

[tesuji]

Re: Drains of Doom? Check out these spells

 

The first two seem OK effectwise for their AP.

 

Remember drain is no range. this means his area one will affect him as well.

 

FWIW, i find with adjustment powers the +1/4 for slower recovery to be very worth its while. It will prevent any effective recovery during a fight.

 

and yes, i found in MY FH games that drains or suppresses on running were effective. Most characters have only their base or a little more.

 

However, i found suppress to running and leaping over an area to be the preferred construct. For 50 ap (book not in front of me) you could get:

4d6 suppress Running +1/2 (leaping too) +1 Area (3" radius 5" diameter) and it works at range. Sure, you have to continue it but thats fine... if not perhaps continuous charges lasting one turn?

 

That will reduce the running by an average of 7" and take leaping right out of the picture at -14". That would stop any normal guys still.

 

Picture it as an entangle spell, a flypaper spell, or maybe even an earth to mud spell. Have a bow handy and you might just be able to sit back and plink them to death.

 

As for the last one, in a multipower, this is bad bad bad... for him.

 

First, in a multipower you normally siwtch between slots and such. Well as soon as he switches out of the slot, the charge fgoes. So, unless he intended to keep this spell slots allocated all day, he will be able to turn it off and do something else twice a day. Thats pretty limited.

 

Second, continuous charges have to have an obvious external off switch feature... again, not that great. I would build the same spell as force field.

 

BTW, if his intention IS to have the protection spell up all the time, its cheaper to buy it out of the MP lowering the MP pool by that much. You then end up with no slot cost wasted.

[austenandrews]

Re: Drains of Doom? Check out these spells

 

It's the old "Continuing Charge in a MP" trick. I've used that construct many times, but it's a definite loophole & you have to use restraint. The only way I'd allow that spell is if (a) it had significant overhead on startup and/or ( it had a clear and/or common shutdown condition.

 

The Running Drain is wicked. I've got a similar spell in my game. You may be surprised how quickly it can change the course of a battle, particularly if the enemy only has hand-to-hand attacks. Plan your encounters accordingly.

 

EDIT: Suppress Running is really nasty because it stacks. I've had major encounters quickly shut down when Giant Clawed Guardian Monster gets slightly out of position, then stuck in place. PCs taunt it as they mosey on past. GM hopes he's got enough other scenes planned to fill the evening, now that an hour-long battle has been cut down to five minutes.

 

-AA

[SCUBA Hero]

Re: Drains of Doom? Check out these spells

 

As for the last one, in a multipower, this is bad bad bad... for him.

 

First, in a multipower you normally siwtch between slots and such. Well as soon as he switches out of the slot, the charge fgoes. So, unless he intended to keep this spell slots allocated all day, he will be able to turn it off and do something else twice a day. Thats pretty limited.

From the FAQ:

 

"Q: The rules state that a Continuing Charge in a Power Framework remains in effect even if the character switches the Framework to another power. Is there any limit to this duration, or could a character with a Framework establish several powers with lengthy durations (say, 1 Day)?

 

A: There’s no limit under the rules, but obviously the GM should monitor this sort of power construct for abusiveness. The intent of the rule is to allow interesting and logical powers (such as smoke grenades in a Multipower of weapons), not to provide characters with huge amounts of power cheaply."

 

So it is rules-legal to switch slots and keep the Continuing Charge going. As a GM, I'd rule it abusive and disallow it; use Force Field instead.

[JLXC]

Re: Drains of Doom? Check out these spells

 

Thanks again for all the Input. Just to clarify I, the GM, am making these spells the player is not involved in the least. So the "I'd make him do x" comments are kinda cute, it's Me the GM you are talking about heh. Not some player trying to get over.

 

Second, I don't like that in Hero that there are few protective spells that last a day. Call me too other system oriented but I like having spells that run all day unless Dispelled. Like D&D Mage Armor or Mind Blank. Next, the character concept is essentially a happy go lucky Cleric who does not wear armor or have weapons, just clothes and a walking stick. Having a bit of protection from the god is good, and I don't understand why so many people would prefer a Force Field over Combat Luck when the power is from a God of Luck? Combat Luck is not a sure thing like FF so I thought people would be all over it thinking it better because it is less Munchkin than a FF (8,8) or some such. However I appreciate all the people who have posted and I have been trying to make sure I'm not going too far.

 

The suppress running is a GREAT idea! I will have to change that one! And I forgot Drain has no range, so I'm gonna have to deal with that too. Thanks for all the help so far keep it comin!

 

[Old Man]

Re: Drains of Doom? Check out these spells

 

I find that Suppress is more effective for the cost in fantasy campaigns. It's ranged, it's cheap, and once you buy the end cost down it's longer lasting than the drain would be. Oh, and suppress stacks.

[SCUBA Hero]

Re: Drains of Doom? Check out these spells

 

Second' date=' I don't like that in Hero that there are few protective spells that last a day. Call me too other system oriented but I like having spells that run all day unless Dispelled. Like D&D Mage Armor or Mind Blank. [/quote']No sweat; use the same construct that you have for slot 3, but don't put it in the multipower - unless, of course, you don't find the lower point cost for it in the Multipower abusive, in which case keep it as is.

 

Hmmmm. . .reviewing the thread, I think the comments are based on having a one day Continuing Charge in a Multipower, not that the construct itself is bad.

[austenandrews]

Re: Drains of Doom? Check out these spells

 

No sweat; use the same construct that you have for slot 3, but don't put it in the multipower - unless, of course, you don't find the lower point cost for it in the Multipower abusive, in which case keep it as is.

 

Hmmmm. . .reviewing the thread, I think the comments are based on having a one day Continuing Charge in a Multipower, not that the construct itself is bad.

Yeah, that's part of it, but really it's the nature of that particular spell that's bothersome. Putting it in a Multipower with a 1 Day Continuing Charge neither adds nor subtracts anything substantial from the spell effect. It's not appreciably different from buying the defenses outright. That strikes me as a just munchkinny way to shave points.

 

Other long-term CC MP slots are just fine -- say, a TK spell to hold a door closed, or a spell of protection you cast on your companions, or a Multiform to transform into an animal (at which point you don't have access to your MP until you regain your true form). But somehow in this case it seems superfluous.

 

-AA

[JLXC]

Re: Drains of Doom? Check out these spells

 

Yeah' date=' that's part of it, but really it's the nature of that particular spell that's bothersome. Putting it in a Multipower with a 1 Day Continuing Charge neither adds nor subtracts anything substantial from the spell effect. It's not appreciably different from buying the defenses outright. That strikes me as a just munchkinny way to shave points.[/quote']

 

I can see your point for sure, and it is sorta. Of course the GM of this campaign (Me) is gonna make liberal use of Dispel Magic and Suppress Magic and such to insure that such spells have their place, but are not foolproof.