Gary Posted February 22, 2004 Report Share Posted February 22, 2004 How about if Tak enslaves Gravitar and the Warlord, and then turns Menton into a Lich slave? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. MID-Nite Posted February 22, 2004 Report Share Posted February 22, 2004 Originally posted by Gary How about if Tak enslaves Gravitar and the Warlord, and then turns Menton into a Lich slave? Uh....pray? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Metaphysician Posted February 22, 2004 Author Report Share Posted February 22, 2004 Ain't that the truth. One last Eurostar tip: if you don't have a code vs killing, and your teammates don't have obnoxiously-high CvKs, don't hold back. At all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuckg Posted February 22, 2004 Report Share Posted February 22, 2004 Originally posted by Gary How about if Tak enslaves Gravitar and the Warlord, and then turns Menton into a Lich slave? Play on Takofanes' vanity and Issue a challenge for them to face you in some suitably deserted area -- and then slip the word to Doctor Destroyer when and where four prime targets for the Orbital Nuclear Death Cannon are going to be standing. Failing that, convince the President that you really need to borrow that strategic nuclear warhead. Given what you're going up against, odds are he'll agree. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Metaphysician Posted February 22, 2004 Author Report Share Posted February 22, 2004 Okay, how about the Crowns of Krim?? My first thought: Mental Attacks. These guys have zip Mental Defense. OTOH, at least some of them would probably qualify as the Alien mind group. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Metaphysician Posted February 23, 2004 Author Report Share Posted February 23, 2004 If you can haul out "Holy" attacks or sanctified grounds, thats a good thing, too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. MID-Nite Posted February 23, 2004 Report Share Posted February 23, 2004 The Crowns of Krim: God, these guys are badass, but here's some general tips: 1) Mental powers are your best hope. As somebody mentioned, none of the members have Mental Defense. On the other hand, only about half of them have EGOs low enough to be affected by mental powers other than EGO attack. Still, that's your best shot. Given that, drop Bloodstone first. He's physically the weakest and his NND affects most PC characters. Phoenix has to go next...as he has a Flash that will neutralize your PC mentalist if you're not careful. Eclipse will be another problem.....as his Darkness might disable the PC mentalists. Still you best chance against them, but examining closely....not as easy as it first appears. 2) Spread out. Dark Seraph's hideously large explosion attack will wipe out the entire hero group otherwise. 3) All the members are reasonably resilient. I'd definitely try to double or triple team members of The Crowns....if possible. Not much more I can say about them. They're a tough nut to crack. Strong attacks, good to great defenses, good mobility. They're the new superteam to beat as far as I'm concerned. They'd easily defeat Eurostar. Rob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vondy Posted February 23, 2004 Report Share Posted February 23, 2004 Originally posted by Gary How about if Tak enslaves Gravitar and the Warlord, and then turns Menton into a Lich slave? As a concerned normal built on 50 points I: whip out my slavishly loyal contact with extremely useful skills and abilities, access of major dimensions, significant contacts and lackeys of his own, an organization in his own right... Tyrannon the Conqueror 20- Heh! I promise him an extra plate of fried oyster mushrooms at our twice a month meeting at the local chinese place. so long as we've opened the door to unlikely pie-in-the-sky scenarios, why not? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Metaphysician Posted February 23, 2004 Author Report Share Posted February 23, 2004 Thats only slightly less munchkinny than the 1 pip RKA, OIF ( Planet Earth ), Expendable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Liaden Posted February 23, 2004 Report Share Posted February 23, 2004 Almost all of the Crowns are fliers, so it would probably be helpful to draw the fight indoors where they'll be less mobile. Alternatively, try to Entangle them so they can't use their wings (all but Phoenix have Restrainable wings.) As with Takofanes, anyone with "holy" attacks will be especially useful against the Crowns; but they're likely to target such a character over others, so his teammates should try to protect him as much as possible for "ace in the hole" advantage. Another good reason to take out Phoenix, since he has a Dispel against holy powers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vondy Posted February 23, 2004 Report Share Posted February 23, 2004 Originally posted by Metaphysician Thats only slightly less munchkinny than the 1 pip RKA, OIF ( Planet Earth ), Expendable. That was the point, wasn't it? And yet, its no less cheesy than having the GMs favorite pet villian take over several of the other master villians of the CU in order to be more powerful than his not pet villian. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BishopofB&W Posted February 23, 2004 Report Share Posted February 23, 2004 Originally posted by Von D-Man Personally, I felt the scenario outlined in the CU that led to the US signing the UNTIL treaty was completely contrived. For instance, which is the quantitatively AND qualitatively better law enforcement agency - Interpol or the FBI? The FBI, of course. The real Interpol is an information clearinghouse for law enforcement agencies. Contrary to popular fiction, they have no authority to enforce any laws. I picture a fictional Interpol as more like in The Man From U.N.C.L.E.. Even there, its strengths would be in investigation and small surgical interventions. It still couldn't match PRIMUS or the FBI for overall manpower and enforcement capability. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vondy Posted February 23, 2004 Report Share Posted February 23, 2004 Originally posted by BishopofB&W The FBI, of course. The real Interpol is an information clearinghouse for law enforcement agencies. Contrary to popular fiction, they have no authority to enforce any laws. I picture a fictional Interpol as more like in The Man From U.N.C.L.E.. Even there, its strengths would be in investigation and small surgical interventions. It still couldn't match PRIMUS or the FBI for overall manpower and enforcement capability. According to the CU book UNTIL suffered significantly in its ability to operate because it didn't enjoy American support - and that the US, after joining the treaty, began to provide the majority of its funding. That being the case - without that boost in funding - why would UNTIL, even with enforcement powers, be able to rival PRIMUS, which would have received the bulk of those funds before the US joined the treaty? Why would the US allow an international enforcement agency to operate unrestricted within its borders when it could simply dump those additional funds into its own agency, which is beholden to its constitution and its direct executive control? Now - with all that funding coming from the US - the united states would enjoy undue influence in UNTIL, but I still find the structure of UNTIL completely improbably, let alone its ability to operate on a paramilitary level within the US. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BishopofB&W Posted February 23, 2004 Report Share Posted February 23, 2004 Originally posted by Von D-Man According to the CU book UNTIL suffered significantly in its ability to operate because it didn't enjoy American support - and that the US, after joining the treaty, began to provide the majority of its funding. That being the case - without that boost in funding - why would UNTIL, even with enforcement powers, be able to rival PRIMUS, which would have received the bulk of those funds before the US joined the treaty? Why would the US allow an international enforcement agency to operate unrestricted within its borders when it could simply dump those additional funds into its own agency, which is beholden to its constitution and its direct executive control? Now - with all that funding coming from the US - the united states would enjoy undue influence in UNTIL, but I still find the structure of UNTIL completely improbably, let alone its ability to operate on a paramilitary level within the US. My take on UNTIL is that since superpowers first appeared during WWII, people would want some kind of international response after decades of seeing the sheer destructive potential of metahumans. I agree that it is highly unlikely that such a group would have the access and power inside US borders that UNTIL has in CU. However, I could see the US government helping establish an agency that can respond in regions that lack the resources to fend off supervillains. It would most likely be dominated by NATO nations and would be unable to intervene without permission of the national government. I'm working on an idea in which the NATO allies helped Interpol develop a Tactical Response and Counterterrorism(TRAC) branch as a response to VIPER and supervillains. It is like a SWAT Team for Interpol. It is incapable of taking on most Generic Villainous Organizations directly. Rather it is a rapid response that hurts and distracts while an attached military battallion (probably on a rotating basis, I don't know yet) scrambles to follow right behind. It is heavily dominated by the countries that provide the most funding, such as the US, UK, France, etc. As far as advanced technology is concerned, they can only dream of having UNTIL's resources. However, President Reagan had the idea of testing out advanced weapons systems as part of TRAC when Congress wouldn't fund it in the regular military budget (Star Wars black technology). Therefore, they have some access to advanced tech under the watchful eye of their principal financiers. It's a work in progress. I use the UNTIL Sourcebook mainly for ideas on organizational structure, names, and gadgets. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vondy Posted February 23, 2004 Report Share Posted February 23, 2004 Originally posted by BishopofB&W My take on UNTIL is that since superpowers first appeared during WWII, people would want some kind of international response after decades of seeing the sheer destructive potential of metahumans. I agree that it is highly unlikely that such a group would have the access and power inside US borders that UNTIL has in CU. However, I could see the US government helping establish an agency that can respond in regions that lack the resources to fend off supervillains. It would most likely be dominated by NATO nations and would be unable to intervene without permission of the national government. I'm working on an idea in which the NATO allies helped Interpol develop a Tactical Response and Counterterrorism(TRAC) branch as a response to VIPER and supervillains. It is like a SWAT Team for Interpol. It is incapable of taking on most Generic Villainous Organizations directly. Rather it is a rapid response that hurts and distracts while an attached military battallion (probably on a rotating basis, I don't know yet) scrambles to follow right behind. It is heavily dominated by the countries that provide the most funding, such as the US, UK, France, etc. As far as advanced technology is concerned, they can only dream of having UNTIL's resources. However, President Reagan had the idea of testing out advanced weapons systems as part of TRAC when Congress wouldn't fund it in the regular military budget (Star Wars black technology). Therefore, they have some access to advanced tech under the watchful eye of their principal financiers. It's a work in progress. I use the UNTIL Sourcebook mainly for ideas on organizational structure, names, and gadgets. In my world there is an organization similar to UNTIL called the United Nations International Security & Intelligence Service (UN-ISIS) that is responsible for international meta-human issues. They operate in a similar way to what you described. They primarily work in an intelligence and investigation capacity, but have to have permission from a member state before taking paramilitary action (be it actual law enforcement or actual crisis intervention). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Metaphysician Posted February 25, 2004 Author Report Share Posted February 25, 2004 Okay, next opponent: The Ultimates. How would you and your team beat them?? ( in my group's case: very, very easily, with nearly no tactics at all ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuckg Posted February 25, 2004 Report Share Posted February 25, 2004 Yeah, but we were 750 freaking points each. And we were so sloppy that three Ultimates almost got away anyway... and we hospitalized two of them when we didn't need to. Slop-py. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Metaphysician Posted February 25, 2004 Author Report Share Posted February 25, 2004 True, but when your greatest concern is how to defeat the enemies with a minimum of harm to them, things are good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. MID-Nite Posted February 25, 2004 Report Share Posted February 25, 2004 The Ultimates: They're generally not too hard as several members have Entangles as their primary attacks. But...some general tactics might include: 1)Behead them. Binder is their primary tactician. Taking him out would reduce their overall effectiveness as well as being a demoralizing blow. 2) Spread out. The Ultimates have many area effect attacks. The last thing you want to happen is to have Slick or Binder immobilize the majority of your team in the opening phase of the battle.(This happened to my group and resulted in their defeat, even though they were generally more powerful than The Ultimates.) 3)Take out the flyers first, especially if your group lacks mobility. This will keep them from getting away and they won't be able to switch opponents as easily(which high mobility supers have a tendency to do.) 4) After Binder and any obvious flyers, I'd probably target Thunderbolt(highly damaging attack) and then Radium(unusual attacks). Blackstar would normally be a primary threat(as he does plenty of damage), but his speed and mobility are so low he can effectively be bypassed until later in the fight. Rob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JmOz Posted February 25, 2004 Report Share Posted February 25, 2004 How the UK Centurians would Handle Dr D: Templar will charge in to fight the being Crownguard will then rescue templar Crownguard will call a retreat, go back to base Crownguard will treat Templar LION HEART will then build with his VPP the following pod for his armor Missile Delfection/Reflection +20 OCV Return to fight, LION HEART will draw his fire Reflect attack back No more Dr Destroyer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Metaphysician Posted February 25, 2004 Author Report Share Posted February 25, 2004 Originally posted by JmOz How the UK Centurians would Handle Dr D: Templar will charge in to fight the being Crownguard will then rescue templar Crownguard will call a retreat, go back to base Crownguard will treat Templar LION HEART will then build with his VPP the following pod for his armor Missile Delfection/Reflection +20 OCV Return to fight, LION HEART will draw his fire Reflect attack back No more Dr Destroyer I wouldn't be so sure. Doctor Destroyer wouldn't KO himself with his own blast; too much defense and CON. He'd probably switch to the 20d6 Explosion. . . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grailknight Posted February 26, 2004 Report Share Posted February 26, 2004 Reflection vs DrD CHEATER! Actually, this comment came from one of my newbie players who had just read FREd for the first time. It seems that pluses to OCV with deflection are considered skills under 5th and therefore can't be placed in frameworks without GM permission. Old rules had OCV plusses as an adder. Live and learn, but it's embarrassing to be lectured by a newbie after 20 years Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuckg Posted February 26, 2004 Report Share Posted February 26, 2004 So? You're the DM, right? Give yourself permission, and then slap 'em with the book. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grailknight Posted February 26, 2004 Report Share Posted February 26, 2004 I like to save my DM power abuse for special occassions Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grailknight Posted February 26, 2004 Report Share Posted February 26, 2004 Not to dredge DD vs Tak, but DD "cheats" to have EGO Def in his VPP. Special powers are still verboten in frameworks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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